Kate Hinds: This is All Of It on WNYC. I'm Kate Hinds in for Alison Stewart. It's Friday and we're about to enter the last weekend before the holiday season, which can be both exhilarating and nervous making. We figured it was a good time to put some good vibes out there and spread some joy, especially if you're having a hard time right now. If something is weighing on you, share it with us, and we'll give you a pep talk. Now, pep talks, motivational speeches are not easy. We love to hear them, but giving them requires insight, empathy, the right words, the right tone, and always the right person. Luckily, we have all of that with our guest today. Comedian, author, friend of the show and all around really lovely guy, Josh Gondelman. Josh, welcome back to WNYC.

Josh Gondelman: Thank you so much for having me. It's such a pleasure to be here with you. I consider my pep talk knack just I have a sense for telling people what they want to hear.

Kate Hinds: Sometimes that's what you need to get over a little bump.

Josh Gondelman: I think so. I think we talk down to yes men, but sometimes you just need to hear yes, and I'm the man for the job.

Kate Hinds: I want to mention that you write a weekly newsletter that's called That's Marvelous!, and it always concludes with a pep talk to whoever or whatever needs them. I noticed that your most recent one included Yoon Suk Yeol, South Korea's recently impeached President. You're not just restricting your pep talks to people who are walking the straight and narrow.

Josh Gondelman: No. Look, I will address anybody that I think needs some pep. I think much like Pitbull, I am bald and worldwide. The deposed-- excuse me, impeached President of South Korea is not off limits. I think he's got all this time now to explore his other interests. Perhaps like President Barack Obama, he will start up a production company, hang a shingle, perhaps like impeached President Donald Trump, he will become the leader of the country again. Who knows? But he has the time to refocus, and isn't that a gift? A little paid time off.

Kate Hinds: It really could be. Listeners, if you are in the mood for a pep talk, if you feel like you've got a lot on your plate, you're nervous about the Holidays, you're putting off a task you need to take care of, or maybe you just want to feel better as the temperature drops and we face our longest night, give us a call. Give us a call. Give us a quick summary of what's happening, and Josh will talk you up.

That number is 212-433-9692. That's 212-433-WNYC. You can also text us at that number. Do you have something weighing on your mind that we can help you tackle with a little extra motivation? Or maybe if you hear someone call in, and you feel like, gosh, I've been in that situation and I have a pep talk, I can deliver them, call us. 212-433-9692. Remember, we don't love to take calls from people behind the wheel, and if you're using Bluetooth, try not to. The audio quality is better. These are the kinds of talking tools you get when you put a producer in a host chair. I'm really concerned about audio quality.

All right, 212-433-9692. Call in for your pep talk, and let's do the first one for me because I could use a little pep talk.

Josh Gondelman: Of course.

Kate Hinds: I'm hosting my family Christmas celebration. I do that most years, and every year our gift giving has been channeled through something called Yankee Swap, also known as White Elephant. It basically has worked well.

A couple of years ago, it got completely derailed due to some family dynamics, and there were bad feelings. I'm hoping this year we can all have a more positive experience. We've talked it through. I feel like we're in good shape, but I admit to a little bit of trepidation. How can I go into the family Yankee Swap feeling okay?

Josh Gondelman: I think it's always hard to enter a situation that's been complicated or painful before because you worry about what problems can reoccur. That's very natural because sometimes people repeat mistakes, sometimes people repeat on purposes that are destructive. I think one thing about this is that it sounds like you've done everything right that you can to try to assure that this will be a smooth and generous, and wonderful time for everyone. The titular, wonderful Christmas time, if we listen to Sir Paul McCartney.

I think that you've done all you can. You've tried to create a loving, warm, gift giving environment. Other people, it sounds like they've committed to it. All that said, it probably will go great given that these are people that care about each other, and want it to go well. It's in nobody's best interest for it to go badly. Then secondarily, if it goes off the rails, that's not your fault.

These are all things that I think are helpful to know, that you didn't somehow screw up if someone gets a little twisted up around it.

Kate Hinds: We just got a text that says, "The worst stomach bug in the world is going around my preschool. Today on the last day of class, my stomach is starting to hurt. Tell me what to do to avoid barfing my brains out for the next three days." That sounds less like a pep talk and more like medical advice. Would you have any words of wisdom?

Josh Gondelman: Yes, which I am deeply unqualified for. I will say, as a former preschool teacher, I feel this one deeply. I taught pre K for several years and it's just unavoidable. You see it coming towards you like a zombie horde, the stomach bug, and sometimes the only way out is through barf, so you may have to barf. But the thing about a stomach bug is that once it bugs you, it's out of ya, and so good luck, stay hydrated and barf wisely.

Kate Hinds: Listeners, if you have a non medical related pep talk requirement, give us a call. 212-433-9692. You can also text us at that number, 212-433-9692. Now we have Linda in Milwaukee. Hi Linda, welcome to All Of It.

Linda: Hi, thank you for having me here on All Of It to talk with you guys. I love you.

Kate Hinds: Thank you for joining us. What did you want to say?

Linda: I was calling to have a pep talk. I unexpectedly lost my not quite middle aged dog, a bluetick coonhound, to a disease called gallbladder mucilage. I just thought she had perhaps a food poisoning, and within two and a half months she was dead. I'm just having problem dealing with it.

Josh Gondelman: That's so painful and I'm so sorry for your loss. I recently said goodbye to my-- we had an elderly pug, she was 17 years old, which in pug years is 17 years is longer than science says they should live. We really lucked out. I think in this situation it is not going to feel good right away. It's not going to feel okay right away, but taking comfort in the good years you spent together, the good life that you gave this animal companion, and the fact that you did everything you could to make them happy and comfortable in the time you shared together, I think is something you can allow to warm you even in this of time of despair and loss. It is really real. It hits you at weird times, and you just kind of have to feel those feelings as they arrive and take comfort in the fact that you had so much great time together, and this loss doesn't diminish that, and doesn't diminish the memories.

Kate Hinds: Linda, what was your dog's name?

Linda: Matilda.

Kate Hinds: Matilda.

Josh Gondelman: Beautiful name.

Kate Hinds: Linda, thank you so much for calling, and we're really sorry for your loss.

Linda: Thank you, and my dog, Matilda, thanks you for making me feel better.

Kate Hinds: Oh.

Josh Gondelman: Oh, thank you.

Kate Hinds: Josh, how did you get started giving pep talk?

Josh Gondelman: Oh, it was a Twitter thing back when Twitter was Twitter, before it was the other thing. I just was in kind of a slump professionally, and I needed to hear anyone go, "Hey, it's gonna be fine. It's fine. This is bad, but then bad becomes fine eventually, a lot of the time." Instead of asking to hear that, I thought if I can put that energy out into the world, I can internalize it myself.

I put out a call kind of late at night after a gig that had gotten canceled because the promoter got there the morning of, and the venue was padlocked shut. I just thought, well, this is really a metaphor for how my career feels, but I put out a call. I said, "Does anyone need to hear an encouraging word?" I got some requests, including, like, "I got these sunglasses, I don't know if I can pull off." I was just like, "I don't know. If you think you're pulling them off, you're pulling them off. That's the rule of sunglasses." It really did help me to say this kind of thing to other people and realize, not everything is okay in the moment, but there are ways through or comforts to be found, even in really difficult situations.

Kate Hinds: What are the elements of a good pep talk?

Josh Gondelman: I think you really have to hear where people are coming from and what the problem is. Pep talks aren't a one size fits all type of thing. You can't just be like, it's going to be fine, because that's not what everybody needs to hear, and it's not even the reality of all situations. Hear what people are saying, respond sincerely, and do really think. I mean, I recently did, I hope this isn't telling tales out of school, but I recently got to leave one of the voicemail messages as a winner on Wait Wait... Don't Tell Me!

Kate Hinds: Oh, my gosh.

Josh Gondelman: For a winner on Wait Wait... Don't Tell Me!, which is very thrilling. This is only my second one. I don't get requested that often, but they asked for a pep talk too, and one thing, they're having a baby in a few months. One thing to think about is all the things that can go right, I think focusing on what can go wrong in a high stakes situation is natural, and you wanna prevent things from going wrong, whether it's a newborn child or a Yankee swap. But thinking about all the ways things could go right, and allowing those possibilities to take up the commensurate amount of space is a very helpful way to start.

Kate Hinds: All right. I tend to be a worst case scenario person in real life, so I'm always reminding myself, dreaded event X? What if event X actually goes well, what if something really good happens at event X?

Josh Gondelman: It's so helpful. I had something a few weeks ago that I was like, you know, it was a time commitment that I wasn't super looking forward to. It was put on my calendar by someone else. It was an obligation rather than a choice, and the day of I went, "Oh, I mean, I'm cranky about this, but probably, it will be a nice time. You will find people to connect with and you have things in common with some of the folks that are there." I ended up going with an open mind to that, and having a really lovely time.

Kate Hinds: We've got a lot of texts coming in. Listeners, I also want to remind you you can call and get encouragement from Josh Gondelman in person. 212-433-9692. That's 212-433-WNYC. "Hi, thank you. I need a pep talk. I retired two weeks ago and feel very lost. I think I need a new job."

Josh Gondelman: Oh, okay. Maybe that's the answer. Certainly, I don't know your life as well as you do. I don't want to say that's not the answer, but a big change takes time to adjust. I think, especially when it's drastic and when you're going from something where you feel very engaged and productive, to something where you have a lot of wide open time and energy to fill it with, it is easy to think like, I should be doing more. But that is one, a lie that capitalism tells us a lot of the time, is that you should be producing things.

Two, it's just natural to feel off-kilter because you haven't filled up this time with new routines, and new meaning yet. You can fill that with whatever you want, and that's really daunting to think like, what if I don't know how to do that? But the 24 hours are gonna pass no matter what you do, and I think soon you will find ways to spend that time meaningfully. Whether it's volunteering, or taking up new hobbies, or any kind of visiting friends. Any kind of thing is an appropriate way to fill this time. You'll figure it out. Or whether it's new job.

Kate Hinds: Right. I just want to underscore that, two weeks is like five minutes.

Josh Gondelman: Totally.

Kate Hinds: Especially if you've been working for decades.

Josh Gondelman: Whenever I finish a creative project, I'm always like kicking my own butt over, why don't I have the next idea yet? It really has sunk in over the years that I just need a little time to let the stake sit, and let my brain kind of cook all the way through, and then start to think about some new ideas.

Kate Hinds: All right. We are going to talk to Michael, who is pulled over in the Finger Lakes region.

Josh Gondelman: Very nice.

Kate Hinds: Hi, Michael. Welcome to All Of It.

Michael: Hi, Kate. Hi, Josh. Thanks for all you do. Like a lot of people, I'm driving through a bleak winter hellscape. Got hundreds of miles of gray road ahead of me, separating me from the one I love. Hoping you can give a pep talk to all of us who are in that situation at the Holidays. One little twist, I think the one I love happens to be sitting next to you in the studio, Josh.

Josh Gondelman: You will make it here. This is great. You have such a great goal in mind, and the time that you spend in transit in this bleakness, it's so small compared to the love that you're carrying with you, and the love waiting for you on the other side of this journey. The bleakness of winter, the kind of gray semi snow that we're experiencing here in New York City, the 33 degree temperatures are a reminder that it's good that our climate hasn't fully cooked yet.

Whenever I'm outside, pulling a jacket close to me, and the winds are whipping around, and I'm cursing God or Satan, as mentioned earlier, I think, oh, thank goodness we can still act in the best interest of our climate and our Earth.

Kate Hinds: I just have a couple of words for Michael. Michael, if you feel like you can't drive safely, do not drive. Pull over and ride it out. Look for the local weather forecast, and make sure that the snow is going to stop before you get back on the road and be really safe. But you're driving an all wheel drive car and I have a lot of confidence in you.

Michael: Thank you, Kate.

Josh Gondelman: Thanks for calling, Michael. Pulled over in the Finger Lakes would be the great first line to a song by the Hold Steady.

Kate Hinds: We will have more with Josh Gondelman right after a quick break. Stay with us. This is ALL of it.

This is All Of It on WNYC. I'm Kate Hinds in for Alison Stewart, and I'm here with comedian, writer and pep talk giver Josh Gondelman. Josh, we've been getting a ton of texts from people, and I want to just circle back to our caller, Linda from, I believe, Milwaukee earlier, who lost her pet. Someone texted us to say the Animal Medical Center in Manhattan offers grief counseling for people who have lost a pet companion, and I highly recommend it. Linda, if you're still listening, I don't know if the Animal Medical Center does this via Zoom, but if they don't, there may be another place in your neighborhood that does, and know that a couple of people have reached out to you to share their condolences.

Josh Gondelman: That's really beautiful.

Kate Hinds: All right, we have a text from a listener who would love a pep talk who says, "Hi, I'm a woman in my late 40s and perpetually single. Bad luck. Haven't found the right person. Holidays are tough, not because of any pressure from my family, but because it marks another year of being on my own and missing this big piece of my life that I'm still hoping for.

Josh Gondelman: Sure.

Kate Hinds: It's a tough one.

Josh Gondelman: Yes, that is tough. It's always tough to not be in a situation that you want to be in, and to be striving for something. I do think, though, and this is a real Pollyanna-ish attitude, and I know in the face of a real feeling of stress and strain, personally. I do think it is also a perfect time, the Holidays and single romantically, is a really lovely time to take stock of all the fulfilling relationships that are in your life. To think about all the people who you love, and who love you, and who care about you, and who are reaching out, or who you could reach out to if you wanted conversation or company or support. To think of how nice it is to not be in the wrong relationship, even in the lowest stakes version of dating someone and going, this is not it for me. This has run its course. I feel nothing, or I feel resentment, or I feel just a desire to walk out the door, or even just change the channel on the TV and go, "No, I'm gonna do, this is gonna go my way."

We talk about romantic partnership as such a focal point of our lives, but there are so many other wonderful, important relationships that fill so much of life and can fill so much of your life. Then again, the wrong relationship, what a drag?

Kate Hinds: Right. We have a listener on the line who has a different kind of relationship, and needs a pep talk about it. Jerry in Manhattan. Hi, Jerry. Welcome to All Of It.

Jerry: Oh, hi, Kate and Josh. I want to tell you my story quickly. I'm a songwriter, and I had a domestic partner and also a music collaborator and business partner named Lou Stallman. He wrote the Here Come The Yankees official theme song for the Yankees. He wrote the song, it's going take a miracle by Laura Nero, The Royalettes, and Denise Williams. He passed two years ago in the winter. He was in his 80s, and I have never been the same since because I was left with a lot of financial things to do for his estate.

I had some other challenges in life. An elderly mother, and I really missed my friend, and with all I had to do, I couldn't even properly get PR to the news about this great songwriter passing. He also wrote the song Round and Round, which I don't know if you guys know, but it was Sia's big Christmas song and Target ads back in the Christmas of 2018. He was alive at that time and so happy, and proud that a modern great singer like Sia recorded his song, which was originally done in the '50s by a singer named Perry Como. Talk about a different generation, but two brilliant artists.

I really miss my friend. I'm trying hard to live up to his legacy.

Kate Hinds: Oh, Jerry.

Jerry: I need a little bit of a pep talk.

Kate Hinds: Jerry, before Josh gets started, can you just say your friend's full name again? Because I want to make sure that we say it on the air.

Jerry: My friend was a Tin Pan Alley songwriter named Lou Stallman, S-T-A-L-L-M-A-N. He was very known in the industry, not a household name, but he had tons of hit records and recordings. People who were big fans of music of the '50s, '60s, and '70s will know his name. He even had a song about kids' problems with their parents, the generation gap called Once You Understand. Howard Stern would play that song every year and say, "This is the worst song I ever heard."

Kate Hinds: Okay, Jerry, I'm going to jump in and just let Josh get to work.

Josh Gondelman: Oh, this is such a beautiful remembrance, and I'm so sorry for your loss. It sounds like Lou's memory is really with you in a way that's really beautiful, but also really painful. It sounds like you're doing the right things. You had to square away so much logistical stuff, which is just so awful when you're dealing with grief as well, to have to also talk to the bank on the phone, which even under the best circumstances, is the worse.

Kate Hinds: Is dreadful.

Josh Gondelman: It sounds like you've done such a lovely job keeping Lou's memory alive, both in your own heart and in speaking of him highly calling us. I'm really grateful that you shared these memories and stories with us. Thank you so much for calling, and I hope that you continue to find ways to feel connected to your friend and his legacy artistically in ways that feel maybe he's still in your heart. Hopefully, as time passes, you'll also be able to feel a little lightness knowing that you've shared his good work and you've shared his legacy.

Kate Hinds: Someone texted. You can give Jerry my phone number. I'm happy to be his friend as well. I love music, which is such a lovely thing to say.

Josh Gondelman: That's really lovely.

Kate Hinds: We have some family pep talk dynamics. Let me get back to that text. "I host my small family for Christmas, and the last four years, our celebrations have been disrupted by COVID, which stunk, but had the upside of allowing me to avoid my only sibling who pushes all my buttons. Assuming that we're all together this year, I'd appreciate some strategies for keeping myself from spending the whole time being annoyed."

Josh Gondelman: This is tough. Here's the difference-

Kate Hinds: Actually, you know what, can I jump in?

Josh Gondelman: I would love for you to jump in.

Kate Hinds: Before we do that, I want to take a call because there's something slight that we've got a caller who's a little similar. Sally in Basking Ridge, New Jersey. Hi, Sally. Welcome to All Of It.

Sally: Hi. How are you guys?

Kate Hinds: Good. You have a sibling problem?

Sally: Yes. I have a similar problem. I haven't spoken to my sister, who we're historically very close, but since the election, I was very upset after the election. We have different opinions on the election, and now the holiday's coming, and I'd like to reconcile. I sent a text to her saying that I miss her and I haven't heard back.

Josh Gondelman: Okay.

Kate Hinds: I Bet a lot of people are in your boat, Sally.

Josh Gondelman: I'm sure of it. That's hard. It's hard to be in conflict with someone you love. It's hard to feel like your overtures are being unreciprocated. I think in both of these situations, in both your call and the text we received just prior, I try not to give too much advice. I try to give more encouragement because frankly, I'm talking to you and not the person you're in conflict with, and so I understand their humanity, but I'm on your side. If they call next, I'm on their side. What I will say also, is that, you're doing your best, and that means a lot. If you're giving a good faith effort, there is pain or through not being able to talk with someone you love, but you can't keep banging your head against the wall if your good faith efforts are going unreciprocated.

To our previous texter, all you can do is your best. Then sometimes you're gonna be annoyed, right? Sometimes people aren't going to respond to your genuineness the way that you hope, and it will feel bad. Then either it will get better, or you will learn to live with things being different. You know what I mean?

I think it is all you can do is your best. All you can do is be a kind, and politically thoughtful person and personally thoughtful person. If the people in your life don't respond accordingly, you can always ask for their side and hear them out. But you can't make this horse drink no matter how close you are to the water, as they say.

Kate Hinds: Yes, and again, it's barely been a month since the election. There's a lot of feelings, emotions, and things. We just need a little time maybe for things to shake out. I have to hope that a relationship that has lasted for decades, can weather this.

Josh Gondelman: I think on both sides, you've tried to be understanding, but also it's okay to go, also, they have to understand me. Like, you deserve as much understanding as you're trying to extend.

Kate Hinds: We just have a couple minutes left, so I think we can do a truncated pep talk that starts specific, but I feel will be universal to a lot of our listeners.

Josh Gondelman: I'm ready.

Kate Hinds: Someone texted. "My boyfriend is down in Florida helping his mom move, coming back tomorrow, and he hates the cold weather. Of course, it's going to get extra cold tomorrow. Can he get a pep talk?

Josh Gondelman: Yes, of course. It's horrible. It feels so physically bad to be in the cold, but that's why we built the indoors. This is a perfect time of year for hunkering down, staying inside, being warm and cozy with people that you love. I think a lot of people don't want to be out in the cold. It's a good time to think about unhoused people throughout the city, what they're going through, and how we can be helpful, big picture as well as little picture.

The cold is bad. It will get warm again. There is a reason that he will be here instead of in Florida, and it's nice to focus on the reasons that you're here, and the ways to ameliorate the horrible winds between the skyscrapers.

Kate Hinds: Can you give us a pep talk for going into 2025?

Josh Gondelman: Yes.

Kate Hinds: I don't know if I want to give 2025 a pep talk as a number, or just give all of us who are about to enter 2025 a pep talk. Take it any way you want it.

Josh Gondelman: Things can always improve, and they can always improve by doing your best. There are people that are out there trying to make the world a better place, whether that's, again, volunteering, mutual aid, even just reaching out to people in your life that you know are having a hard time. You can always be a part of that. It's never too late to do something for someone else, or to ask for help that you need.

As bad as things may be at any given time, you can always start being a part of the solution, and you can always look for someone to help you solve problems that are ailing you. I think even as bad as things get, that's a nice thing for me to remember is that you can start right this instant making things a little bit better through your own effort, listening and diligence.

Kate Hinds: What's the best pep talk you ever received?

Josh Gondelman: Oh, my gosh. That is such a good question.

Kate Hinds: You have 10 seconds to tell it to me.

Josh Gondelman: My wife is so encouraging, and she's just the most wonderful, generous person, and just so lucky to be the recipient of her love and encouragement, especially around the Holidays.

Kate Hinds: You have a newsletter called That's Marvelous! How can people sign up for it?

Josh Gondelman: JoshGondelman.substack.com is the website, or you can find me on social media, @JoshGondelman, and I'll make sure that you can find it via a link there.

Kate Hinds: Josh Gondelman also hosts a standup show called Frankenstein's Baby on the first and third Mondays of the month at Union Hall. Josh Gondelman, thank you so much for coming to the studio.

Josh Gondelman: Thank you so much for having me. Kate, what a treat. So nice to see you and Happy Holidays, everyone.

Kate Hinds: Thank you.