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A Bronx teen grapples with a controversial plan for NYCHA apartments
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( Carolina Hidalgo/WNYC )
When Fanta Kaba was growing up, her family moved around a lot. Harlem, Queens, the Bronx, even North Carolina for a while. But when they moved into public housing, they finally found stability. Now, a controversial plan is changing the way public housing operates — and a lot of residents are scared about the future of their homes.
In this installment of Radio Rookies, Fanta speaks with residents, organizers and officials as she tries to find out what this program means for families like hers.
Radio Rookies is supported in part by the Annie E. Casey Foundation, Epstein Teicher Philanthropies, the Margaret Neubart Foundation, and The Pinkerton Foundation.
Fanta Kaba: I have a big family – so I rarely get any privacy. When things get too loud or when my siblings annoy me – I just go to my room and shut the door.
Sounds of Fanta’s family talking and arguing. Sound of door shutting.
Fanta: Alright, so this is my room/ On the wall there's a bunch of posters. One of them says “Don't stop trying.” And “life is fantastic.” And then there's, um, a poster of, uh, Jimi Hendrix, and another one is Rolling Stones.
Fanta: I LOVE my room, it’s my favorite place. I do have to share it with my annoying little sister but it’s way better than when I shared one room with all five of my siblings. Or when we lived with my grandparents and aunts and uncles. Growing up, we moved around a lot. Harlem, Queens, the Bronx, even North Carolina for a while. My dad drove taxis and my mom was a home attendant – but their jobs didn’t pay enough. When I was 8 – we moved into a shelter. It had blank white walls and we didn’t put anything up because we knew we were just gonna move again. It never felt like home. But the day we moved into NYCHA, my siblings and I were so hype. We picked out paint colors at Home Depot. And when my parents started buying furniture, that’s when we knew we were here to stay. NYCHA gave my family stability. We know our rent won’t go up – and it’s the only place I’ve ever considered home. I know thousands of New Yorkers can relate. But public housing in our city is changing. The New York City Housing Authority is putting for-profit real estate companies in charge of tens of thousands of apartments. The plan is called PACT: Permanent Affordability Commitment Together. It’s also known as RAD. And NYCHA residents across the city have protested against it.
Protest chants: People shouting “keep public housing public.”
Fanta: They’re worried that they’ll be evicted or displaced – and lose some of their rights as tenants.
Protest audio: Someone speaking: What private developer do you know that gives a damn about low income people?
Fanta: This is all happening because public housing in New York City is kind of falling apart. And it would take billions of dollars to repair. NYCHA can’t afford that. So they hand buildings over to private real estate groups. Those companies pay for all the renovations, and along with private buildings managers, they do everything – from collecting rent to cleaning the hallways to handling leaks. This is a big deal. I wanted to know: What does it really mean for families like mine? What I learned is there aren’t any easy answers.
Audio from a Zoom meeting:
Ramona Ferreyra: …Link right now so folks can join and watch our stream…
Fanta: Ramona Ferreyra is an advocate for public housing. She runs weekly Zoom meetings from her apartment in Mitchell Houses, a few blocks away from me. She starts by checking in with everyone on the call.
Audio from a Zoom meeting:
Ramona: And Arlene, why do you fight for public housing?
Arlene: Because I need a roof over my head and I have no other family to go to, or – I need a roof over my head.
Fanta: Ramona founded Save Section 9, a group that wants the government to prioritize public housing – which is also known as Section 9.
Audio from a Zoom meeting:
Resident on zoom: I’m tuning in to find out what's going on with these buildings
Fanta: She wants to make sure residents understand what’s going on. I’ve read a lot of articles and talked to journalists, organizers and experts – and this so-called “privatization” program is still kind of confusing to me. People refer to this program as “privatization” – because it allows private landlords to come in and manage public housing. The private companies benefit because they get to keep our rent money. And they get money from the federal government. Residents benefit because we’ll finally get renovations. But Ramona says this whole process puts our rights at risk. As Section 9 residents, we have really stong tenant protections.
Ramona: You have eviction protection, you have a right to mediation, you have a right to, uh, have legal resources.
Fanta: But this program converts our apartments out of Section 9, which is traditional public housing and. They become Section 8 apartments. You’ve probably heard of Section 8. It uses federal dollars to help low-income people pay rent— to private landlords and property managers. Most of our tenant protections are supposed to stay the same. But people don’t trust these new landlords to follow the rules. And I can see why. A report from a nonprofit called Human Rights Watch says there’s not enough oversight of these private companies. And, this year, the city comptroller announced an investigation into eviction rates in these converted buildings. Even though people are scared about the changes this program would bring – it might actually be the most promising way to get repairs. Because federal funding for public housing has declined for decades.
Jonathan Gouveia: Which is why NYCHA has been developing a series of programs to bring comprehensive renovations.
Fanta: That’s Jonathan Gouveia, the Executive VP for Real Estate Development at NYCHA. The agency launched the PACT program seven years ago and has already converted 18,000 apartments. They’re working on almost 20,000 more. But some residents aren’t too happy with their new property managers. When Sonji Lopez heard about the renovation plans at Betances Houses in the Bronx, she thought it would solve all of the leaks, mold, and pest issues in her family’s apartment. She was so excited, she even appeared in a promotional video NYCHA made. I found it on YouTube
Audio from a video on YouTube:
Sonyi: I trust that PACT has the residents’ best interest in mind.
Fanta: But this enthusiasm didn’t last
Sonyi: The paint was the first thing. The paint started chipping in like a matter of days. Also it was like incomplete in the bathroom, you know, we had to complain about missing sealants around the bathtub. Mold you know, accruing even more than it did with NYCHA
Fanta: So what kind of oversight is there when it comes to these companies? Jonathan Gouviea, from NYCHA, told me management companies are required to submit monthly reports. And everything is carefully tracked.
Jonathan: So if somebody puts in, you know, a ticket with a heat outage, for example, are they responding to that quickly enough?
Fanta: But how are they holding these companies accountable?
Jonathan: We do, in our contracts, make very clear that we have the ability to replace a PACT partner if we feel like performance is not where it needs to be.
Fanta: Some residents, like Tyeissha Brown, are happy with what PACT has done for their buildings.
Tyeissha Brown: In calling maintenance and fixing and repairs, they are very rapid.
Fanta: She lives in Ocean Bay Houses in Far Rockaway.
Tyeissha: My apartment is fine. I really don't have no complaints. I do have a complaint about, uh, the refrigerator. Um, I get mold…
Fanta: There are still some issues – Last year, a group of NYCHA residents in Far Rockaway got together and talked to more than 100 people at Ocean Bay Houses. 19 percent said their management company had tried to evict them. 40 percent said conditions had gotten worse. NYCHA has made some changes in response to the backlash. Soon, some residents will get to vote on the future of their development. They can join the PACT program, stay Section 9, or there’s a third option called the Preservation Trust. We all know our buildings need repairs – and you would want a management company to come in and do NYCHA’s job better. But this program gives for-profit landlords control of our buildings. And these contracts last for 99 years. Our choice isn’t just a choice for us – it’s a choice for the future of public housing. If my complex ever gets to vote – I know it’s not gonna be an easy choice. For WNYC, I’m Radio Rookies reporter Fanta Kaba.