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Welcome to another edition of black man in America these programs are presented by your city station in cooperation with the negro book of the Month Club moderator for the series a city commissioner of human rights William Booth who interviews authors on various aspects of Negro life in America here now is Commissioner book Good evening this is Bill booth I'm here to bring you another in a series of discussions. Today the black man in America devoted as this title states to examining the history and life of an Afro Americans and the contributions they have made and are making to the material cultural and spiritual wealth of this country this includes all of living not just civil rights the black man in America is produced by station N.Y.C. and the negro book club incorporated I was my host moderator Each week we will have as a guest the author of a book dealing with Negro history or culture we're very happy to has had a like guest tonight Mr Floyd B. Barber editor of an exciting new volume of thirty six essays and titled The black power revolt published by Porter Sargent of Boston is the April selection for Book Of The Month by the negro book club and it's also of course available at bookstores was the barber as I look over your book I see that your contribution as editor is a good deal more creative than merely compiling available material and then seeing that it got printed with no errors What prompted you to think of such a volume I wasn't prompted to think of the volume I don't see how anybody who is black in America at this point is prompted to think about black power black power mean survival therefore that was the one subject being talked about wherever I went in Boston Philadelphia New York Washington where I come from so therefore I was not prompted to think about black power black parking lot of just the fact that there it was in the you know in part what determined you to write a book about it though. That's a good question I think I was determined to write a book about black power one evening in Boston when I walk through a section of last of the north in and my life was threatened and I realized for the first time that I was not being threatened because I was Floyd Baba but because I was black and I realized that I was being threatened because I was black I realized for the first time I should start mourning those black people who have gone on who've died at that point I decided that I would put out a book called The Black power revolt it's interesting most people think of the term black power as shouldn't say most people but many people or the media point up the term black power as being strictly a product of modern times first being voiced in a road in Mississippi in one hundred sixty six and yet you open your value with a letter written by Dr Benjamin Banneker in seventeen ninety one and you continue with material by other early figures in American history such as Nat Turner and Frederick Douglass Why do you feel that black power has historical roots in America way before nine hundred sixty six I think black power I think the word power has roots back to the beginning of the world which is nature about what power so therefore I could have gone beyond Benjamin Banneker going back to the first slave revolts. Yes I do believe that black power has always existed somewhere in our subconscious and I believe that for the first time Adam Clayton Powell in one nine hundred sixty four said our data is power he was the first person perhaps to say or dayshift power but I believe that the idea has always existed in the black consciousness but of course we know about the book by. The man who used to be the has a head of the uneasy peace Mr Du Bois in his book in one thousand nine hundred three and you cover that in your in your essays Also I was interested in a letter from one slave to another announcing a revolution will be uncivil revolution in South Carolina right and it is interesting to you point out that letters in those days could not be mailed by a black man they had to be handed from person to person which is a very smart thing I think if you have a system built upon suppression and up pressure and of course you can't have letters so therefore the whole idea has been the keep us from knowing what our cultural background has been some of the historical persons that you speak of in the book like Ben and Benjamin Banneker most of our students today don't know anything about him at all which I don't understand because I'm from Washington D.C. And there's a sky school called Banneker high school sure you know I went to Boston and I was very surprised to find that one of the great battles in Boston recently has been the battle to get a high school named after a black person yet in Washington we have many high schools I went to Dunbar High School with Anika so therefore I knew about it was you but you see Washington D.C. is on the borderline of the north and south and I think the student of the North has failed to attain any sense of the accomplishments of the black man in America because. There just has not been any conscious effort to include it in the curriculum. And yet you've got black schools in the south which do emphasize. The contributions the black man Benjamin Banneker I think we ought to know something about him would you tell us something about him and you know more about him he actually has to the thing he's a person who helped chart as the book tells you help chart the boundaries of Washington D.C. which is something which all of you know knocked me for months for a loop I didn't know this I knew it I heard he was a great mathematician and also a person who put together a Armin Act which was well received Yes I would see and how much the clock didn't have I don't o'clock I don't know what that I do know what the almanac and perhaps a clock also yes it is a clock or something that I should know about well in Frederick Douglass's another one that we know about but we don't really know about the accomplishments that he's made except through your book and through some of the other materials that are coming to us these I don't know I think Douglas has been much more and better so I treated and many of the other people think that Douglas has been well treated by many people I think he has known for the most part well who are some of the modern figures that you represent in your essays the margin figures I represent in the essay are not all the people who are represented because the essays themselves mention many many other people you know like the article by Chuck stone yet in the black car conference and in this book I thought that once you mention a person you don't realize this person existed and you to sort of sense his history therefore in the book I chose those people that. I chose those articles which changed me that is I chose those articles which when I finished reading them I was not the same and I chose the wrong Jones of course because he's a great black man Carmichael Nathan Wright Jr who helped me very much he was a person who said to me that I must learn to invest the word black. I chose Albert who saw because he's a great he is just a very fine writer so Sharjah psychologist Adelaide Hill. It's interesting us that yes it's interesting too that in the Negro book club newsletter your book is called quote the product of pain can you explain that the product of pain and the product of joy I think it's a product of pain and that just staying alive and surviving can be in itself a painful experience but it's a product of joy these people are talking about their survival our survival and we are talking about memory the memory of all the people who've gone before us this book is about memory I feel that and the American America that we live in so much time is spent trying to make us forget so therefore this book is about memory and about survival and if these two things create pain and I don't want to say about that living is painful getting to see you today was paying for getting to the areas paying for it comes out of pain because staying alive is painful but it comes out of the black consciousness and black living which is joy because we do have joy it's interesting too that you know you have presented different approaches to securing of justice and I think this is something that white America has to learn that there is a room for differing approaches by different people to the same goal would you come in and there's yes I'm always asked the question about our division you know within the group but I'm born under the sign of cancer which is a crab and the crab moves forward to the sides and back so little creature which moves in order to get where it wants to go has to go one step back two steps to the side and I say that at this present moment the movement this is all the same movement the crab it's all the same body it's all trying to get it is trying to get where it wants to go so therefore there's. No division we're trying to get and we're doing different things but it's all the same thing liberation of all people liberation and land land property property and survival forty acres and a mule Oh no baby no no with interest now and then nothing that was just blind forty acres and a mule and we'll vote on it we haven't got it though if we had the land we should have gotten it because many of us have white blood many of us should have gotten you know plantation so yeah land Taishan so I'm not talking about forty acres I mean I'm talking about a chunk of Rockefeller Plaza I think Reverend Abernathy when he was describing the Poor People's Campaign and starting it off use the term forty acres a mule saying that what we really need today is forty acres a mule with interest over these hundreds of years which would probably be a chunk of Rockefeller Plaza you as you put it or even so give each child in Harlem each child in Harlem you know one little little piece of Acre acreage right now in Rockefeller Plaza which over the years America is built upon property upon receiving property land and a future is a true to that Columbia University was given a piece of property and that's what all the fights about the gymnasium that was built or to be built in Morningside Park Parkland being actually given by almost two point eight acres of land being rented at three thousand dollars a year two point eight acres of New York City land being rented to the university for one hundred years one hundred year lease that seemed to me to be a way of giving acreage away and the forty acres and a mule that were to be given to slaves when they were freed still was not given to them at all and Mr surprise you and surprise me you know I mean you know we have an Indian who owned America and what does he have Indiana is named after him I suppose and actually the word Indian I had some Indians in our programs and they say that word Indian is a falsity too because actually Columbus when he. Came here and quote discovered America he discovered people here of course so he did as governor Mark it all but when he came here. He found the red man was here and the red man in the Sioux language says that he is called the uncle way who way the all riginal one he didn't come from anywhere he didn't come from India or anywhere else he was here always and therefore the title Indian is false because he really should be called the and why who he or the original one may I just say something else here about black power there are those in our society who try to make Stokely Carmichael and Rap Brown and others define black power is the Black Power defined anywhere in your book I think go across the front over and over and over that is defined by the very fact that it's a book with all black people in it that's the first thing that we can do it that's the first that's that's what Black Power is about we can do it alone if we have to so that's where you find with black power it's about without trying to put it down in words. Precisely works down blood we have blood you know Bobby Hutton out in California was shot yes trying to talk about black power the Black Panthers put down blood you know Leroy Jones was beaten up when you say Bobby but I think we want to make that clear this is something that's topical Capa just happened a few days ago it's happened well yeah I happen to few days ago but it's happened over you know centuries. Now also I understand you had some difficulty in obtaining some of the contemporary selections and some that were written in jail no others and similarly difficult situations could you tell us how you were able to compile this have I'll say this I've never had any I must admit I always thought it would be difficult it wasn't difficult because black people in the book were so willing to help me I couldn't believe it you know they were Jones who had was in Newark during a very difficult time and Jones wrote to me wrote an article for me during this very difficult time and other people and they said Herr who had just been dismissed from Howard University wrote op they were so willing to help me so I didn't have a difficult time when I say that I had I said the authors at the time of these articles were themselves having difficult times but they came through to me to try to tell other people what they know and what they have lived through at this period in their history how long did it take you to compile all these letters Well the glib thing is it took four hundred fifty years to compile it and the actual thing is that it took about two years to compile and two years is a long time to be able to get all this material together but of course some of the contributors you say asked me you know what where in the book when it's a book coming out where's that book. Where. I can well imagine I was very much taken with the letter from an to slave rebels in seventeen hundred ninety three and I think that's most important to recognize that black people were standing up even though they were oppressed and even though it was difficult for them stand up even in those days as you say you could go even back further than that you could find there and then the. Are some people who are trying to take credit for a lot of things today that you point out in the book the thing I'm trying to say is I think there's a great deal in America of trying to forget for instance we forget that there was a march on Washington one nine hundred fifty one you know is that the March on Washington one hundred three was the first time we've we mustn't forget anybody and that means white and black you know mustn't forget white all black people who have helped in some way or other to get us where we are at this present moment now you speak of white but Americans and Jonathan calls or who wrote death at an early age of Boston I believe Boston school children and I said white people will not enjoy reading this book but they would be foolhardy to ignore it would you comment. It's difficult for me as a black person to comment on why white people not you know it's a difficult question yet I don't think it's a question I should lend myself right now to is for them to know this is Mr Kozel Staples or he let it stand you know it is of course I think interesting that a white person has said that white people will not enjoy reading this book but they would be foolhardy to ignore it and certainly I think that brings out the natural intrinsic value that is evident in the letters and the other pieces that you've brought together in the book. You've got something about Nat Turner you've got something about for example why not turn to me because I want to correct the impression at that book on that Turner you know because I feel why should read a book by a white southerner on one that turns out when we have that turn and no one wants to read not turn a one man and I don't know what I asked seller and they won't read the person who read Nat Turner it's a stylized version Anyhow it's not even the truth and it's the but it's portrayed as not being the truth is portrayed as being fiction and yet I think that the press has built it up as being exactly what Nat Turner said you know are being what they believe opening when one white person believes a black man could think I don't know I don't I'm not against the idea of having any office who is doing you know a creative person attempt to. Project what I feel taking a historic because of all right now because the fact many of our heroes have been denied as we haven't had a chance to really know who our heroes are that a white person take this this hero and utilize him or exploit him I think this is what the danger. You know you have. Been published by a publisher in Boston have you had any success in having the book bought do you know what the the number of books have you been able to sell so far I think so far we sold our total files and since pre-publication date. And I see you have it in paperback also correct so that it's available to people in paperback at a cheaper cost than it would be in the hardcover we wanted to come out mostly in paper because we felt that people could. Get the paper back and would reach more people can white Americans gain from reading this book or are you leveling it at every American or just of the certain group of people. Ken. Again I feel you know questions about white Americans I should not answer I think too many times you have black white Americans answering a question about black Americans and right now why should I do that let the white Americans worry about that let me worry about black people. When you'd spoke to Roy Jones and you said that he was very cooperative along with many others and getting materials for you. Would you be able to comment on anything that he may have said to you about the new extenuation what the new works are right situation no I could not I can say what he said to me about the book what it was the fact he felt the book should be a big black Vista book at the time when I began the book I thought I'd sort of make it a much more Catholic with a small c selection and they were I Jones the person who said no you have got to get a book which will be a big black list of a book with black people now Mr Barber Freud be Barbara you are a an editor and you are a playwright and you told me you were about to be a novelist could you give us anything in advance on your your novel that you're planning you know I've been asked to do a novel for young people which I think will get me into a different situation I think that the Black Power vote is a very public event in a way connects all different peoples which is a great experience I feel as I say in introduction I feel more or less like not as the author I'm just an editor one of the people one the people of the black community and this is for the black community and it comes out of the black community and all the people involved in it are so many people people present people not present I would like to do a novel for young people which would do you know for young people with a black youth and try to deal in a way with a black youth. Attempt to understand what it is what his father is and where he is. Here the the publishers or out of the Negro History of negro book club rather in. Saying what your book is all about said that some books define a moment and create a climate for debate the black power revolt is one of those books there are times which urgently call for a book to define them but back par revolt answers one of those calls ranging across three centuries this collection of essays comes out of a people's shared attempt to chart a political economic and cultural identity often this collection seems a single statement a profile of a people contrary in its totality human in his attempt to fashion away from bewilderment know what the book logs the meaning of black power at the grassroots level know what the book makes available the information needed to trace with understanding the many facets of black power no other book comes out of the black community with the force and focus of this one here is a big black fist of a book The Black Power of old is a contradiction a confrontation a challenge to the consensus and I think that last part a challenge to the consensus is what you're aiming at I should not speak for you and certainly would ask you is this true that is your book is a challenge to the consensus Hopefully it is I think and I think it is I hope so and now your book that you will plan your novel for the youth do you have any idea when this might be brought forth I hope to return to Washington D.C. Washington D.C. for three weeks of homework when it don't or three weeks and I hope this book will be a book because that was a whole different thing it's about youth and about children I don't believe there is such a thing as children sadly that that's another American creation of childhood and I don't believe that there's a child I think young people are very much aware and can and do respond to things if you're honest with them to be honest with you do you intend to return to the stage with a play at any time to topple a going on May twenty first. In. Boston at Simmons College called a work and a play this evening will be a little sliver of a play will be going on T.V. in the T.V. on. Which was filmed at Harvard University and how would it how and what is it called Auto Sacramento which means a Sacramento act a Sacramento act and this is about the student rebellion so-called No it's not it's about the absence of God Oh I think I thought maybe was about a student a valiant because that is what people seem to be talking about so much these days have you any plans to delve into the rebellions that have popped up on our campus in recent months why should I do that when at the word about being black and black people watch it I do that you know that's another piece of technology which we're often we're talking now but I think so much time is spent away from dealing with the things we have to deal with. And I know I will not be dealing with through three billions I have black people and black survival to deal with right now my own survival so that to me will take up a lifetime and I think black people instead of just chit chatting and talking we talk talk talk and I read a thing yesterday with Alex Childress who is has a talk on keep talking but this is I think right now we want to deal with those problems which deal with our survival as black people and that means black people we have we live in Roxbury we live in seventh Street in Washington we live in Newark the daily events that affect our lives and this would be your concern in the future could you tell us something about the your plays in the past have you done plays on the black power theme or could you tell us what you've done now in the past I thought I was white so therefore I replaced the priest white audience and I think this book is to let me that what is needed the book has demanded that I Be Black which I left the pope for I think the book has been great but this came out as a result of a single incident or rather the single incident was the thing that provoke you into getting together the black power and say I don't think any black person has a single incident I think every moment of your life is the incident which propels you towards that thing that confrontation which can be a confrontation with words or confrontation with bullets or a confrontation with people or what have you so there was no one moment which propels me I couldn't say this book began here it could have been done in Copenhagen where I was I could be gun in Boden College where I was or how university where I was Begin anywhere where there are black people but you say that this confrontation with a person in a dark street in Boston was what convinced you you needed to do the Black Power vote it was the first time I really remember crying not for Anne Frank but for Megha Evers I went back to them and I felt very I felt very hurt because I did sell that I was a person it wasn't a Floyd Baba was being shot I would just blow. That's who I am and it's that acknowledgment of being black and that no matter who you are no matter what station in life we're all in the same box that's what I think you're saying we're in a same box until we give our group Pala Pollak to prove property Senator Brooke gave a definition of black power last June in which he said Black Power is the black man's response to White irresponsibility but you can't comment. Repeat that black power is a black man's response to White irresponsibility is that saying it in a very nice way are so black fall is not the response to anything Mark white the black power is being black and we're not going to sponsor white people this white that's another way of saying you know give us give us a favor it's always a white man who makes the rules and we respond in some way we are not responding we are not exerting our reality in our definition of being black and this is the closest to definition that you would want to come I'm sure or do you have a definition of black power that you'd like to I think said it several times already I think that black power means survival as nothing else no other way that there is no other way and there's no other way Black Power means a viable in the economic identity political identity social identity. You don't propose any programs for the future and you don't in this book or elsewhere do you I think the book proposes several different programs possible means of attaining political social economic power I would hate to I believe that this right now I think that is a whole new area under which I like to delve how to implement black power whether I could write this book of the allowed to write it I don't know but how to make Black Power work we know now what are all of different things which have kept black power from working now how can we make black power a reality. Well I see that our time is up Mr Barber I want to thank you Floyd B. barber for being our guest on the black man in America and discussing your collection of the Black Power revolver to our audience if you have not read it already you will find it profitable from the for the insight it will give into a major contemporary trend please with us again next week when we will present another book and author dealing with an aspect of Negro life in America the black power a vote has been put out by Sergeant Porter Sargent of Boston and can be obtained through the Negro Book Club of New York this bill both saying thank you and good night that concludes this broadcast of black man in America moderator for the series is William Booth City Commissioner of Human Rights we welcome your comments on this program and suggestions for future broadcasts send them to Commissioner booth care of W. N.Y.C. New York ten double zero seven black man in America is presented in cooperation with the negro book of the Month Club join us again next Tuesday at this time for another of these broadcasts.