National Politics with Rep. Rice

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Brian: Brian Lehrer on WNYC. Okay, here's what Mitch McConnell said in a speech on the Senate floor, just since we went on the air, are you ready? This is a transcription from the New York Times, "Many of us hoped that the presidential election would yield a different result. But our system of government has processes to determine who will be sworn in on January 20th. The Electoral College has spoken. Today I want to congratulate President-elect Joe Biden."

He hadn't done that before. He hadn't recognized the presidential election. He was keeping mum and tacitly supporting President Trump's claims of fraud. He also congratulated Senator Kamala Harris referring to her as the Vice President-elect. He said let's see, is this is a quote? Yes. He said, "Beyond our differences, all Americans can take pride that our nation has a female vice president-elect for the very first time."

Notably though the majority leader did not directly address Trump's continued and baseless allegations of widespread fighting fraud or what the Times calls fantastical claims that he had won the election by a wide margin. Instead Mr. McConnell, effusively praise the President for his four years of service spending several minutes listing what he said were important achievements in domestic and foreign policy before he ever mentioned Mr. Biden's name. Nonetheles, Mitch McConnell has now said President-elect Joe Biden and Vice President-elect Kamala Harris for the first time. It further marginalizes Trump's baseless claims. There it is.

Segueing from the last segment, if businesses are increasingly shutting down again, and people are increasingly out of work long-term. The next thing that we can't stop focusing on, even if the politician stop focusing on it, is COVID relief. We know Congress has been stalled for months and there was a Christmas cliff, maybe we should call it a Kwanza cliff because many current COVID benefits expire on December 26th.

With us now to talk about that and Mitch McConnell's statement and more is Long Island Congresswoman, Kathleen Rice. Democrat from New York's fourth congressional district. That's south of the LIE, roughly from Mineola down through Garden City and H,empstead and down to the ocean, including Long Beach and around there. Congresswoman always good to have you welcome back to WNYC.

Kathleen: Thanks for having me, Brian,

Brian: Your reaction to Mitch McConnell.

Kathleen: It's about time. I have just been so disgusted Brian with the behavior of my Republican colleagues in the House. Time and time again, from Rudy Giuliani to all the other attorneys that the Trump campaign hired to go into courts primarily in the battleground States. To go in and claim that there was fraud. They stood outside on the courtroom steps and claimed all of these crazy fraud theories. Then would go into court and be asked by a judge, "Give us the evidence," and they would admit that they had no evidence.

They even went so far as to go to the Supreme Court who just summarily dismissed their claim. But 126 Republican members of Congress had signed onto that Texas lawsuit to overturn the results in four other States. It's just a ridiculous, ridiculous claim. Do I wish that Mitch McConnell had done this earlier? Yes. I wish there was some Republicans with a backbone to say what everyone knows, whether he supported Trump or not, that this was a free and fair election and Trump lost fair and square, and that there is zero evidence to support his claims of widespread fraud. I am hoping that now that McConnell has finally said the obvious that other of his colleagues will follow suit.

Brian: It also means there isn't going to be any drama on January 6th. There may be some histrionics from members of the house primarily, and maybe a few senators. There's not going to be any drama in terms of whether Congress will accept the Electoral College results which is the one final step that needs to take place. McConnell certainly guaranteed that today.

It was guaranteed anyway because the House is Democratic majority and it would take both houses of Congress to reject the electoral college so it was already sealed. Now, there's really not going to be any drama as Jim Acosta, the CNN White House correspondent said on TV last night. Given all the Republicans who are now coming out and recognizing Biden's election. He said, "Trump is just going to keep saying the election was rigged and he won in a landslide until nobody's paying attention anymore."

Kathleen: Hopefully. Look, I understand what it's like to lose. I understand, I know people. I have some people very close to me who supported president Trump and I know what it's like when your candidate loses, it's not a good feeling, but we have to move on. If this democracy is going to last and we're going to persevere, we have to just acknowledge that yes, there is disappointment in losing an election. From the very beginning, you remember Brian, that Trump said, "The only way we're going to lose is if this election is rigged," and that's just not true.

Yes, Trump got 10 million more votes than he did back in 2016 but guess what? Joe Biden got even more. There's no question that he won the popular and the Electoral College vote. My hope is just that we can get more Republicans. You heard Paul Mitchell say, "I'm leaving the Republican Party because I can't take what they're doing. What they've become." That it's just this cult of a one, Donald Trump.

We have to just move past this. I thought that what President-elect Biden said yesterday was very true. He said it really strongly, "That we just need to get past this and whether you support me or not, I'm going to be a president for you. That's the rhetoric that we need to embrace on both sides of the aisle.

Brian: For people who don't know your background, you're a former Nassau County DA, so you're a prosecutor. I can only imagine that you've thought as a prosecutor reading the Trump lawsuits with a legal eagles eye that they were insane. You must be proud of the judicial branch in front of which you used to practice.

I think this is really important to say, that a main institution of democracy, the judicial branch of government, along with a lot of state level elected Republican officials. Held together against the tribal onslaught of populist authoritarianism. Because we could tell throughout the entire Trump presidency that he would establish himself as a post-democracy authoritarian leader, if he could. He's stress tested the entire system over these last weeks and months.

We see what held, it didn't take civil war in the streets. It didn't take even mass protests in the streets. It took the judicial branch of government and the state legislative branch of government, and some Republican governors just having a bottom line. Trump has no bottom line when it comes to his own power. Some Republican elected officials at the state levels, ones who matter who lead state legislatures and Republican majority States and courts. Including 38 Republican appointed judges according to the Washington Post count held the line between truth and power.

Kathleen: Especially looking at the Supreme Court where Trump in unprecedented fashion had three appointments. They joined and said, no, go, this is no good. We're not even going to consider this case. If you look, this is what I have been talking about, especially given, as you said, Brian, my law enforcement background. We all know how countries devolve into authoritarian rule. It is a methodical attack on first, the free press calling them the enemy of the people, which is what Trump said from the very beginning.

Then it's the deep state that's embedded in federal agency and our intel agencies. Then it's the court and they have no backbone and anytime they rule against them, they're a terrible, terrible branch of government, it has been methodical. There are historical references to look at the rhetoric that this president has engaged in for four years and the constant onslaught. Our institutions have survived and the courts have said, "No, Mr. President, we are an independent branch of government."

Now, it doesn't help that Mitch McConnell basically sold the Senate and thereby the entire Congress. Because whatever we passed in the House, Brian went to Mitch McConnell's office to die. He basically said to the president, you are right. I'm going to give you the control of the Senate. None of us are going to say anything against you. You want to pass this tax cut for rich people and corporations, we're going to support you. You want to call this pandemic a hoax, we're right behind you.

Kathleen: Thankfully there were institutions that didn't sell out and that is what gives me hope that the rule of law still matters. People recognize that it is not fair that the president and his friends who get sick with COVID get a cocktail of medical treatment that is not available to anyone else. They don't like the fact that his friends get all the tax breaks when middle-class families and poor people are bearing the brunt of it.

I'm very hopeful that President-elect Biden is going to be able to bring us all together because the bottom line is we are all Americans. We are not Democrats or Republicans. We're Americans and we should stand for that and reject any of this authoritarian rhetoric that is just going to take us down a very treacherous path.

Brian: Let me ask you this then. My guest is congresswoman Kathleen Rice, Democrat from Long Island. You have a politically mixed district and many people voted for Trump. National surveys show most Republicans at least until last week had continued to believe the election was stolen despite the absence of evidence. In a way that's even more troubling than whenever Donald Trump himself does, because we can write Trump off as a narcissistic conman. Then all these regular people buy it. How much do you see it in your district, and how do you understand it?

Kathleen: I see it in my district. Absolutely, there's no question. In order for me to win, I have to-- Just as my background, I grew up as you know, Brian, in a Republican household in Garden City, Nassau County very Republican County in those days. I have always been an elected official for all people regardless of what their political parties are. I think that I enjoy a support amongst independent and Republicans supporters that maybe some other Democrats in this hyper-partisan time would not enjoy.

I don't take that for granted. I represent my constituent to the best of my ability. I think the bigger issue here because you are right. At some point, Trump is going to leave. Who knows what kind of clown show he's going to have in the future. If he's going to start his own TV station or just go try to maximize his four years in the White House? We have to address the issue of disinformation and misinformation. That didn't start with Donald Trump. He manipulated it and used it to his advantage. We don't have just ABC, NBC and, CBS anymore. I remember the days when the TV you had to get up from the couch and actually turn a dial to look at 1 of 13 stations.

People are getting their information from so many different sources and platforms and that is what is so disturbing. Social media plays a large part in that. I will say that we as a Congress have not done enough to hold social media companies responsible for the information that they allow to be put on their platforms. When I talk to people and say, “Where are you getting your news?” They're not saying CNN. They’re not even saying MSNBC or Fox. They're talking about OAN. They're talking about all these different platforms some of which you've never even heard of.

Their parroting these crazy disinformation, misinformation things like QAnon. That is something that we have to get a hold on. Because it’s a big enough problem domestically. It is through social media platforms that bad State actors like Russia and Iran manipulate the American psyche and feed this information to a point where people are doubting the very foundations of our Democratic Society. That is what we have to get at the heart of.

Brian: We're not going to go down this rabbit hole today of the media, but it's a mixed bag. I don't pine for the days of just three major television networks in this centrist establishment white male, even if a little liberal-leaning place, having a monopoly on the news. It's good that they're a million media outlets on one level, but then it also leaves people vulnerable to ones that are really disinformation platforms. [crosstalk] Obviously, complicated discussions that we’ll continue having.

Kathleen: I agree with you Brian. I'm not saying that we should go back to just having three sources of information for the public. There has to be a level of responsibility for journalists. For instance, I am a new Dem, I'm a moderate Democrat. You can't get anyone to be interested in me talking about working across the aisle with my Republican counterparts to work on legislation that's going to make life better here. All they want to hear from are the far-left and the far-right and you give a megaphone to the far-left and the far-right. It manifests this or creates this division in this country that you're either far-left or far-right. There’s no one in the middle who just wants to get stuff done.

If Joe Biden is going to be a successful president, he's going to have his successful administration which I believe he will. He is going to maximize his relationship that he has with people in the Senate and the House. He’s going to do it in a bipartisan way. The days of Democrats being in control and just passing Democratic supported legislation or Republicans doing the same. That legislation never last and you just go through these cyclical moments. You don't have long term fundamental systemic change in this country. If we want legislation that's going to last and stand the test of time, we have to do it in a bipartisan way, but I do believe there should be responsibility.

Brian: You tee up a clip from Biden that I wanted to play anyway from his speech yesterday. After he gave evidence about the election result, he promised to reach out across the political divide.

Biden: In this battle for the soul of American Democracy prevailed. We the people voted, faith in our institutions held, the Integrity of our elections remains intact. Now it's time to turn the page as we've done throughout our history to unite, to heal. As I said in this campaign, I will be President for all Americans. I'll work just as hard for those of you who didn't vote for me as it will for those who did.

Brian: As a radio person I can sympathize with Joe Biden having to clear his throat at just the wrong moment because it happens. To your point congresswoman, people say it's about tribes, but I think it can be about policy. Many Republicans felt the Obama Administration did not take their needs into account whether fairly or not and felt that Trump did whether on social issues or his economic nationalism and whether you think they were good policies or not?

What do you see as the policy priorities that separate Republicans let’s say in your district from Democrats. Where Biden could actually say, “Look I'm taking your problems into account and solving your problems, but I'm also taking my constituent's problems into account and solving their problems.”

Kathleen: That’s a good question. I think that it's going to be or there's a dual track. How is Biden Administration going to handle international issues and us rejoining the International Community as one tact? The other from a much more domestic base. He is going to have the very difficult task of coming out of a pandemic that none of us have ever seen in our lifetime. My hope is and I believe that the more Biden talks about these issues of reconciliation and unifying the country. I think it's going to be critically important. What piece of legislation is the first major piece of legislation that Biden Administration tries to pass.

I know it will be a bipartisan effort because that's what President Biden is going to want. How does he say, "I'm addressing the needs of the people who supported me and even those who didn't?" Look at the four states. Well, you have Georgia for the first time in how many years went and supported a Democratic presidential candidate. Look at this Wisconsin, Pennsylvania and Michigan. These are states that went for Trump by a much smaller margin in 2016, but went for Trump nonetheless and voters who were traditionally seem to be Democratic voters.

This is one of my issues with the Democratic Party Brian, it's a discussion for another day. How do we define our supporters? I think that we look at antiquated view of who are traditional Democratic candidates supporters, but that's again as I said, another topic. I think that Joe Biden is uniquely positioned to address the concerns of people in those four states who four years ago were Trump supporters. Say, “I know that you supported Trump, but this is what we are going to do.”

“We're going to put I hope a robust infrastructure package together first thing January 21st that's going to also incorporate additional COVID relief, that's going to put people back to work. It's going to solidify our healthcare systems, it's going to keep small businesses in business. It's going to help repair our crumbling infrastructure all across the country." We saw that most blatantly with kids not even having access to broadband when they have to learn, do at-home learning. We have so much work to do just domestically, forget about the international stuff. I think that that is going to be a very unique opportunity for President-elect Biden to show that he means it when he says, “I'm going to be a president for every single American, not just those who voted for me.”

Brian: This is WNYC FM, HDNAM New York. WNJT-FM 88.1 Trenton, WNJP 88.5 Sussex, WNJY 89.3 Netcong, and WNJO 90.3 Toms River. We are a New York and New Jersey public radio. A few more minutes with Democratic congresswoman Kathleen Rice from Long Island. As she puts herself in the moderate wing of the Democratic Party. We'll have to do this more explicitly and longer in another segment. I wonder if there's anybody listening right now who voted for Trump who can say to Congresswoman Rice. “Look if you and Joe Biden talking unity want to win me over, here's what you can really do for me on a policy level, make it a policy comment," and let's see.

Let's see if we can help launch this National conversation in this little way. Anybody who voted for Trump, may be for policy reasons from your point of view and takes Biden and my guest at their word that they're interested in unity. What can they actually do to show it? 646-435-7280. 646-435-7280. In the meantime, let's take another call from one of your constituents. I believe Jim, in Wantagh you are on WNYC with congresswoman Rice. Hi, Jim.

Jim: Hi Brian, it's my first time calling. Thank you, representative Rice. I'm in your District. Wantagh is the gateway to Jim’s beach. People on the air don't know that. I'm calling here because I'm very concerned on the CARES Act money and how it's being used in the Town of Hempstead. It's $133 million that looks like it's just going to be going to paying government employees instead of using it for things like school-based rapid COVID testing, or broadband access for all. I know you called for a federal investigation and I just want to share that I'm concerned as you are.

Kathleen: That's a great question, Jim. Is that your name?

Jim: Yes.

Kathleen: Jim, thank you so much for the question. Let me just give a little historical perspective here. We passed the CARES Act and it was signed into law by President Trump at the end of March of this year. Because of a quirk in the legislation the way it was written, instead of having $240 plus million going to Nassau County as it did to Suffolk County. Because of the Town of Hempstead population being that of over 800,000 people, they got more than half of the money that was meant to go to Nassau County. That was back in March.

Now, since that time, there have been minuscule disbursements to food pantries, to universities, and to hospitals by supervisor Clavin. I've met with every single mayor that make up the town of Hempstead. I met with the Hempstead School District saying, “We need tablets for these kids.” “These kids don't have computers to learn at home.” I said to all of them, “Do me a favor, put a list together of all of your expenses. I'm going to take it to the treasury department and I'm going to get a pre-approved as appropriate COVID expenses. Then you send it to the town supervisor, Don Clavin, and ask him to reimburse you.”

He refused. At that time saying, “You know what, I don't think it's legitimate expense," even though we it a pre-approved.” He made an admission that I think is going to come back to bite him. He said to the mayors, “I want to hold on to this money because my hope is that at some point they allow us to use this CARES Act money to replace lost revenue.” Of which he said at that time total $40 million for the town. Now, here we come up in a bipartisan way by the way, including Peter King. hen this CARES money was given out James.

We all went to Don Clavin and said, “Will you work with County Executive Laurra Curran?” She has the lion's share of the expenses. The Town of Hempstead doesn't have their own police department or fire department. All of those services are provided by the county. They are the ones with the COVID expenses. Don Clavin has been trying desperately trying to find COVID expenses we can spend that money. We have been begging him in a bipartisan way to help transfer that money to the County so you can pay your first responders and there don't have to be layoffs during a pandemic.

At the very end almost two weeks before this money is going to be called back by the federal government if it's not spent. He makes these crazy, my term, these disbursements to sanitation operating fund of over $43 million, another $17 million to a general fund. Not that we shouldn't take care of our sanitation workers, but with no delineation of what that almost $60 million is going to pay for. It's just crazy and that's why I called for the investigation by the Special Inspector General for CARES Act money.

I hope it's all on the up-and-up, but it looks really bad to me. It looks really bad to me, and that's why I think I'm not the DA anymore. These should be investigated by-- We asked for this state comptroller Tom DiNapoli to look into this and the special IG and we'll see what the outcome is. At a time where people are desperate for help, parking this money in these accounts where you don't even know where the money is going to be spent is just wrong.

Brian: Does this alleged misuse of COVID funds helped make Mitch McConnell's case that state and local government funding in the bill. Which he generally opposes, but which I'm sure you think like all the New York and New Jersey officials and increasingly people in Republican states too where COVID is hitting so hard and starting to deplete state and local resources. McConnell's case opposing state and local government funding in the next coronavirus relief bill that he's just in effect throwing money at the general expenses of those places.

Kathleen: Yes, but you know what though Brian, this is different. This CARES Act money was specifically focused on COVID related expenses. Now, do I wish that every public official would do things by the book? Yes, of course, I do. Do I think there is a way to write a piece of legislation that would allow for a level of accountability and transparency into how that money is spent so we the taxpayer can be assured that that money is going for its intended purpose? Yes, there's a way to do that. There is a way to do that. Remember, it's not just blue states that lost revenue. Red states did too.

Mitch McConnell should check with the people in his state of Kentucky and see how they feel about the fact that when their stores and businesses had to be shut down. How they felt about that and the impact that that had on their everyday life. This is not a red or a blue state issue. There are ways to ensure that this money-- This is why there was a special inspector general specifically for COVID related expenditure, to make sure that the money is being spent correctly.

Brian: We're almost out of time. I'm going to take one more call. Because one of the next things up for the Democratic Party now that the election is over, is the debate within the party about what kind of policies to pursue and there's a sort of moderate wing? I don't want to oversimplify it but there's a moderate wing that you identify with and there's more progressive wing that I think our caller Ryan in Brooklyn identifies with. He's got a question for you. Ryan, you're on WNYC with Congresswoman Rice.

Ryan: Hi congresswoman.

Kathleen: Hi.

Ryan: I was just listening earlier. It felt like you were situating yourself and maybe people who call themselves moderate as like wanting to get stuff done versus what you characterize as the far-left. I don't know if I would call myself far-left, but I'm 30 years old. I work in a restaurant. Most of my other friends who are also around my age also work in service jobs. Pretty much everyone I know voted for Bernie Sanders. Again, I don't know if we would call ourselves far-left. It's not like we want to burn things down for the sake of it, but I think for a lot of us, it felt that is what his message or someone like AOC who came from the same places us in a lot of ways.

Brian: Ryan just for time, what's your number one or number one and number two policy priorities that come from that position?

Ryan: Well, so it's like for us raising the minimum wage, getting unions for more jobs, creating good jobs to fight climate change. Having access to actual health care isn't going to cost us 20%, 30% of the money we make a month. That feels like getting something done and I would appreciate it if that was acknowledged, instead of us being characterized as just like people who want a pie in the sky. We want to live an honest life too, and wanting those things, wanting a good life for us and being able to pass on a good life to the next generation, I don't think that's crazy.

Brian: Ryan, thank you.

Kathleen: I agree with you.

Brian: Honest call, and please call us again. Congresswoman, obviously, this is a conversation that we're having on an ongoing way on the show and in America. We have 30 seconds left in the segment for anything you want to say to Ryan.

Kathleen: Ryan, thank you so much for your question. I was talking about far-left, far-right, in terms of the media and what they try to focus on. There is so much agreement that I have with you. Yes, we need to raise the minimum wage, it should be $15 an hour, there is no question about that. An infrastructure package is going to lead us to good jobs. We can build it in a way that's going to be environmentally sound for the future and yes, we need every single person to have access to quality health care.

Those are Democratic principles that we all share, regardless of whether you call yourself a progressive or a moderate. I know that Joe Biden is going to incorporate all of those policies into whatever major bill he comes up with. Of course, I will support that. I am with you and I understand your concern as a 30-year-old, who's living through a pandemic that is just leaving you with an enormous amount of uncertainty.

Brian: Democratic Congresswoman, Kathleen Rice from Long Island. Thank you for your time today. We'll keep having you on.

Kathleen: Thank you, Brian.

 

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