Six years ago, on Staten Island, Eric Garner was killed by NYPD officer Daniel Pantaleo, in a banned chokehold that was later criminalized as a policing practice. A grand jury decided not to indict Pantaleo after the medical examiner ruled Garner's death a homicide. The moment sparked widespread protests against police brutality. Now, in 2020, we are still seeing advocates rallying against the criminal justice system in the United States. 

Yasmeen Khan, who covers policing for WNYC, spoke with Paul Butler, constitutional law professor and author of the book "Chokehold: Policing Black Men" on All Things Considered. 

"We didn't talk about reforming slavery. We didn't talk about reforming the old Jim Crow, and I think we have to be more ambitious than in thinking about only reforming the new Jim Crow. I think we have to think about transformation." said Butler. 

Click Play to listen to the full conversation.