From the Great Hall of the Cooper Union in New York City. National Educational radio presents a lecture entitled inward journey schizophrenia and mythology. This lecture was recorded for broadcast by station WNYC. Now to introduce the speaker. Here is the chairman of the Cooper Union forum series Dr. Johnston easy for a child.

Good evening ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to the forum. This is your chairman. Johnson The third freaking beautiful migrate all the Cooper Union another great man talking to you so that's worth a lot. With us and Joseph Campbell. Sarah Lawrence College. In your case you haven't read any of the 18 books. I am holding up. Not for the radio audience obviously but. For the local audio audience The Masks of God this is a fabulous story. We don't sell. And that they have that. The topic. For tonight is the n word journey. Has to do with schizophrenia and mythology. And. Here's this second of the series. Prep programs that Mr. Campbell is giving here. In case my introduction there's not a. Lot of talk are enough. Here's a great guy and I love him. Come on Joe.

Johnson some three or four years ago I was invited to deliver a series of lectures at the S. Lynn Institute and Big Sur California. On schizophrenia. By the way when you phone big sister from New York. The New York telephone operator says big Seward. I had like to dead the year before on mythology and apparently Mr. Michael Murphy the director thought there was some connection. But since I didn't know anything at all about schizophrenia. I phoned and said. Mike I don't know anything about schizophrenia. How would it be if I lectured on James Joyce. And. He said that to be fine. But he said I'd like to get a lecture on schizophrenia just the same. And so I'm going to arrange for you and Dr. John Perry of San Francisco to give a dual talk the two together on schizophrenia. Well in my youth I had had the great good fortune to kissed the Blarney Stone which is worth seven Ph.D.. And so I thought OK why not. Then Dr. Perry sent me a copy of a paper that he had written on schizophrenia. It had been published in 1963 in the annals of the New York Academy of Sciences. And to my great amazement I found that they imagery of the schizo phrenic paralleled almost. Point for point. They themes that I had rendered in the Hero With a Thousand Faces. Back in nineteen forty nine. Which was very simply on a comparative study of mythology it had nothing to do with psychoanalysis or psychology but it was simply a synthesis of the materials and imagery of the mythological traditions of mankind delineating the constant motifs that did appear in all. These are universal archetypal themes in the mythologies of mankind. And from this paper of Dr Perry I discover that they are produced spontaneously from very broken off. Condition of a complete schizophrenia complete psychosis a person who has lost touch and Tiley with the context of his society and is functioning out of his own. Best. Very briefly the main pattern. Is one of. Cut offs or departure from the local social order. Every treat in word backward in time as it were and inward in to the psyche and encounter a series of terrifying experiences and finally if fortunate and counters. Of a symbolic kind that center harmonize give new courage to the individual and then every turn journey. This is the pattern of the myth. This is the pattern that came up. In these images of the psyche. That was Dr. Perry's a thesis that in certain kinds of schizophrenia. The best thing is to let the process continue not to abort the psychosis not to perform any psychiatric operations such as shock treatment or anything of the kind that will abort the psychosis but to help the person along. In order to be helpful however the doctor has to understand the imagery of mythology. Yes to understand what these signs and signals are that this person totally out of contact with the rationally oriented individual is trying to bring forth in order to establish a contact. A psychosis from this point of view is an effort to recover and restart or a lost balance and. Let the person go he has tipped over but help him through. While while I was out there I had some very exciting for me conversations with Dr. Perry and our dual statement. The talk we gave together was for me a very great experience and it started me thinking more and more about the immediate import of this material which I'd been dealing with NMR less scholarly academic personally its enthusiastic way but without any sense of it's possible in part for people in trouble today. Then. Dr. Perry and Mr. Murphy gave me a paper by Dr. Julian Silverman which had appeared in the American anthropologist in 1967 on schizophrenia and Sharman ism. And there I found something very interesting. Again. Because of course. When women studies primitive mythologies the imagery of the mythological world derives from the psychological experiences of the Shah Monde. The source of the imagery of primitive methods. Is the Shah Montse psychological crisis. The Shah mon is a person who in his early puberty has cracked off broken off and gone into what we would today call the psychosis. And the Bashaw money sense for a mature Shah mind is sent forth to help him through this. And by interpretating they gestures. And so forth of the young. Psychotic. He brings them out of it. Now let me just tell you the story of a one shot man. A situation that is described by Rasmussen the great Danish explorer who in the early 1920s went across the north to north america. Men of great human sympathy and understanding. Who is able to talk. With the Shah Mons whom encountered in northern Canada and so forth along the Arctic Circle. Very simple society and understand and appreciate their experiences and what they have undergone. And there was one man who told him of what had happened to him. When this shaking and retreat from the world came on his parents knew that the best thing to do was to stand for a sham and to help him through this. And this young man according to this account. Put him on a sled and took him out on to the wastes of snow built a tiny little igloo hardly big enough to contain him lifted him from the sled onto a skin in the igloo and left him there for 30 days and brought him every 10 days. Some time the little bit of food and water. And he said I died many times during that time. But there came to me experiences that one can come to only in solitude and in silence. Another Shah mine my samosa met in Alaska. I told him of a similar adventure into the silence. Now this young man was in trouble with this community. Germans have a very dangerous job because if anything goes wrong I think where people blame it on the shah man I think he's working magic. Anyone who has powers that other people don't have is likely to be an object of jealousy and and you know suspicion. And so this old fellow had invented a number of trick devices and bit the logicals GATT the seeds to frighten people and keep them at bay. Rasmussen knew that this was all fakery and he said to the old man isn't there anything you believe isn't there anything that is honest and sincere in your life. Oh yes he says but I have to protect myself with this hocus pocus. But he said I'll tell you what is true. I have heard the voice. Of the universe. And it is gentle. And it is kind and it is like a mother speaking or it is like the fall of snow or it is like children laughing and playing. And what it says is Do not be afraid of the universe. You have had the kind of experience that one hears stuff from the great mystics. He's a very simple man. Now assume a man in his article has found analogies with certain kinds of schizophrenia. It was from this article that I learned that there are two quite different orders of schizophrenia. One he calls essential schizophrenia and the other he calls paranoid schizophrenia. Now it's essential schizophrenia you are approaching the shamanistic attitude and crisis. It is one withdraw from the impact of experience in the world. This happens. Spontaneously. There is a narrowing of concern and focused. The object world falls away and invasions of the unconscious content overtake and overwhelm one. This he calls as essential to Freya paranoid schizophrenia is just the opposite. The person remains extremely sensitive to the environment but interpretating it all in terms of his own projections. That is to say his own terrors his own fears his own sense of being assaulted from inside he projects outward and he thinks the world is assailing him. This is not the one that leads to the kind of inward experience. This leads to a person being a kind of lunatic in the outer world. The other is is a very pitiful thing to observe a person who is fighting these terrible struggles with the psychological energies within. Now what is the difference between the essential schizophrenia and the case of the Shah Mon. The difference is this. The shaman does not reject the social order and its forms. It is actually through them that he comes back. And he reinforces them. His symbology is at one with the symbology of this culture or on the other hand it comes back to really inform the culture world when he has remitted returned from the crisis. Whereas in the psychosis there is a break off and the there is no communication with the symbol system of the culture. The symbol system of the culture is not helping in the psychosis. The Shah Mon. There is an AI card. Well then in New York. This all came in and one in a quick series. In my experience a psychiatry list in New York Dr. Mortimer last doll invited me to be discussant to a paper that he read before a society for Adolescent Psychiatry here in New York in which he was dealing with. LSD. Psychosis. And mysticism and what he called antinomianism while that is to say anti social attitudes which are rather frequently advertised in the papers and TV used today is socially valuable. While this was an extremely interesting affair because here a whole new same lines of thought came in all in association with the same things. Now it turned out here was that as I'm trying to analyze dissent and discussed it with a doctor. The LSD retreat and would relate somewhat to the essential schizophrenia situation. They. Antinomianism is because it is more like the power annoyed schizophrenia that is to say a sense of threat from outside and the society of the establishment is absolutely. You know there's a break there's no communication with it and all that and it is only interpreted only in negative terms and not in terms of any understanding of what it's really about. So you have you might say a lunatic asylum without walls. People are out in the street that ought to be in the bug house. But this is a kind of violent outwardly directed action. The LSD thing is is fascinating in relation to this. It is intentionally achieved schizophrenia so to say with the hope and expectation for spontaneous remission which doesn't always occur. Yoga is also an intentional schizophrenia. One breaks off it turns inward and that the mystic process as well is very similar. Now what's the difference between the mystical and the psychotic experience. They plunge into the same water as there's no doubt about it the symbolism is just the same. And I want to speak about it in a little while but it is. The defense said. That the mystic. With the instruction of a master or because of his own native talents. Is able to swim in those waters. He does not drown in them. Whereas the schizo phrenic has gone in and has drowned can he be drawn. They are the same waters. Now let's ask ourselves what are those waters. They are the waters as I say that are imaged in the universal archetypes of mythology. And I've been working on this all my life and I can tell you there are these universal images. They are the same all over the world. They are interpreted differently in the different traditions. They are given different emphases different rational applications or different social concerns to support. But the images on the same. And they come in the same relationships to each other. What do these represent. These are the images given the psychology of young are called the archetypes of the collective unconscious. And what he means by the collective unconscious is. Those. The powers. That derives from the biological instinct system of man. All animals operate. Instinctively as well as in terms of relationship to the immediate circumstances of their. Activities. They are impelled by powers which they did not think out but which really govern their lives. So is man so governed. It is these powers that manifest themselves. Through these archetypes. Now with respect to animals. I remember seeing a member having seen a very interesting nature film I think was one of the Disney films of a turtle laying eggs in the sand over about 30 yards from the water. And some days later. Out of the sand and the camera was there. Come these tiny little just born turtles about as big as a nickel. And they without a quarter of a second hesitation started right for the ocean. They didn't hunt around and say now what would be a reasonable place for me to go now. Why did they make any mistakes and first go fumbling into the bushes and then say OK and then turn around. I meant for something better than this. They went like that. And meanwhile the seagulls said boy dead they are. And these dive bombers started coming down on these tiny little nickels that were trying to get to the ocean. And these little fellows knew darn well that that's where they had to get. And they went as fast as their little legs and the legs knew what to do they knew what their eyes were meant to go to show them where to go. The whole thing was in perfect operation where the whole little fleet of little. Tanks going for the water. Well now you'd think that so these little turtles these terrific breaking waves would be terrifying and those silly dolled up they're not frightening at all. On the contrary they went right into the water and they knew how to swim. Meanwhile of course the fish caught at them. Life's tough. People talk about going back to nature they don't really know what they're doing. Now this whole system is exactly that. There have been some very interesting experiments that I've mentioned I think here before made on little chickens that just hatched from the egg in a little chicken coop. If a hawk flies over the nest those little things run for protection. If a pigeon flies over they're not concerned at all. They learn this. Who's acting when a little thing says Oh here he comes I don't know. And the psychologists have made a little. Imitation Faux. Out of wood and drawing them across the hoop on a wire. The little things run for shelter if the same Hawk is drawn backwards. They don't move. Now there are these are called innate releasing mechanisms. And this stimulus set going a system of action which is built into the central nervous system. There are steps in man as well. And this is what is meant by instinct. The complication of instinct if you will read for example some of the life histories of parasites you believe it read that the life course of a hydrophobia parasite and you won't think that a human being is worthy to be host to such a genius. But they know what to do where to go and how to set people mad. Now in the human being we have an instinct system and it is pushing us. But we have also. A culture system. Another peculiar thing about man that distinguishes him from all other animals. Is that he's born 12 years too soon. No mother would wish that. It should not be self but nevertheless. There are these twelve years of utter dependency that they the child. Is committed to. It is during those 10 years or 12. That the child is turned into a human being. It learns to walk. As its people walk. It learns to speak to think to cogitate in the vocabulary of that local language. It learns to respond with enthusiasm to certain signals and with fear to others which are not natural but are socially oriented and socially. Functional functioning signals. A mythology. Is the context of nature and culture signals in such a close amalgam that you can hardly distinguish them from each other. And they work on the psyche as naturally and spontaneously as the stimulus of nature on an animal. A functioning mythological symbol. Is an energy evoking and directing sign. It does not have to pass through the brain and be interpreted there. It works like that. The brain however may enter fear and short circuit it. And when that happens. That signals are not functioning. Or one may become. Conditioned to a system of signals which are present only in a very small portion of the environment. For instance people who are brought up in quite special sects. Which do who do not participate in the culture forms of the rest of the environment they can never learn to participate in the culture except in its small dimension. The small dimension of their local family and so forth that person is is disoriented in the larger world altogether. There's a very important problem families face to know that the signals that they are imprinting on their children are things that I'm not going to alienate them from the world in which those children are going to live. They have to be in accord with at least the progressive decent aspects of the world into which they're coming. So we have this terrible problem in the human system of signals delivering messages to our psyche which may or may not. Relate us. Propitious late to the environment. And when the signals do not related to the environment we find ourselves in white in the mythological world its called a wasteland situation. The world does not talk to one. We do not talk to it. When that happens the individual is cut off and thrown back on himself. And it's then that this crisis occurs which may be called the psychotic break off. Let me before going into this history of the break off the crisis and the return just to another where the two about how they functions served by a functioning mythology. They are fourfold there are four main functions that a traditional operative a healthy mythological system serves. The first is about why be called the mystical function to awaken and maintain in the individual a sense of awe. And gratitude for the mystery dimension of the universe and not to be afraid of it but to recognize that it is his own mystery dimension as well. That's what that Sharman meant when he said Do not be afraid of the universe. It is terrible. It is monstrous. It is the kind of thing that makes existentialist Frenchmen say it is absurd. The wonderful thing about the French is that they are so imprinted with Day cards. That anything that doesn't correspond to the teaching logic must be absurd. But you may ask yourself who's absurd when that kind of language is used as philosophy. The second function of a mythology is to present an image of the universe an image of the universe which works in terms of the knowledge and science. And fields of achievement and action of the people of that time. And. Through that process my logical image comes the dimension of mystery as well. Now when a mythology like that of most of our inherited religions is based on a cosmologist as I pointed out last week of four thousand years out of date there is a discontinuity there and we are being introduced to a world that is not our world at all. This kind of inheritance is. You might say. Drive to schizophrenia. The third function of a mythology is to validate support and inculpate the norms of a given specific model order that of the society in which the individual is living and the fourth function is to carry an individual through the stages of his development. At the first stage of course that of the child in utter dependence on his family for 12 years. On the earlier biological levels there is a condition comparable to this the condition of the marsupial. You know kangaroos and wallabies and a possums. That these are not placental animals there is no placenta so that the little fetus cannot remain in the womb after the yolk of the egg has been consumed. And so it must be born before it's at all mature. And after 18 days the little kangaroo is born and spontaneously through instinct it crawls up to its mother's pouch attaches itself to a nipple that would swells in its mouth so they can't get loose. And there it is in a second womb a womb with a view. Now I think it's important to realize that one of the first functions of mythology is to serve as a womb with a view. And it doesn't matter whether it makes rational sense on the heart what matters it is does it keep the little developing psyche Coetzee. Does it furnish it spiritual emotional feeling nourishment. Does it help it to grow up to be a kangaroo in AAT society and not in that of some other part of the universe or a time of human history. The mythology has to bring this little thing to maturity and then the aim is for the little think to step out. To leave the myth to be as they say. Twice Born to leave the myth behind. Now one of the unfortunate things about our religious institutions is that they ask not to be last behind. They ask to keep control of you all the while and you know what happens. It blew up back there in the 15th century and been trying to piece pieces together ever since the goal is to grow out of the myth. And then of course. As soon as you learned what the society wants you to be able to do cause in the world. Just think of the Ph.D. you're in the woman till you're 45 years old. I noticed on TV when professors asked to answer questions they hum and haw and and all this and you got to figure out yourself whether they're having a crisis of some time or rather they're just trying to find words for exquisite thought. But when a baseball player or football player is asked for some very difficult question he answered it with ease and grace. He graduated from the woman he was 19 and was the best pitcher in the league. But this other poor chap he's been sitting under a auditorium of professors and even though he's got his Ph.D. He's still looking to make sure that they're going to give him the right credits for everything he says. Then no sooner do you learn what you're supposed to do in your society then you begin to drop the ball a little death. It's getting harder to do things and they say what the goal set aside you know. Old Age Pensions and all that kind of thing and you've got to find what to do with your psyche then that's the period of a nervous breakdown. When you go into an unprepared unconscious and you drown there it's very much better during the early years to begin to learn what the scenery is going to be when you get down there and then you learn. Ah here he is. This is God the Father. And then you think oh yes this is the dragon Now I know how to kill him and when I do I just take a little bit of the Hottentot a bit then you know how to behave when you encounter these monsters. Now with that little preparation let me tell you what I found out about the psychotic crack up through reading these works and through then meeting a couple of real psychotics. The first. Experience one can call the regression. The regress source. There is a sense of split. This is the way it begins. The person sees the world as two orders and one part of it dropping away and he's in another. It moves away. He sees himself in two rows This is very interesting. One role the role of the clown that the outer role that he plays a joke making little of himself the fool the one kicked around the patsy. Inside he's the savior. He knows it. Next we have an experience and this is described very vividly in a number of accounts. Of terrific drop offs and regression backwards or backwards in time. Biologically backwards people have the experience of going back into animal consciousness Animal songs back to sub animal forms even plant like forms. You know the legend of Daphne who turned into a tree. That is a psychosis. The person she couldn't face the lice crisis cut herself off and went back. A person goes back in his own biological past also even back to the womb and becomes a little a little infant. But then in the following this and in the course of it there come great feelings of. Uniting with the universe what Freud calls the oceanic experience. Feelings also of new knowledge things that had been mysterious to you fully understood in affable understandings come through and they do. This is no fooling. These are coming through. I've been amazed to read accounts of these experiences that parallel Hindu mythology perfectly. The person gets a sense of having lived many lifetimes of having lived forever. The person has actually united his consciousness I was left of it with that consciousness of the species the consciousness of biology the consciousness of the rocks and plants out of which we've come. And he is one with this which has indeed been forever and as we all have been goes back. Into this world. Then there comes a sense of a tough task and danger to be mastered. Also of divine presences that will help one through this and. If one has the courage to go on. That come the final crises. There are four typical file crises and these will vary according to the kind of difficulty that led the person to the experience. For instance a person who has been brought up in a home with very little tenderness very little love. Very little test for him but only off Dorothy and regular. And do this do that. Or are. Too mild and wrath in the house. Drunken father ranging around the place all this. This person is seeking a reorientation a re centering in the scent of love. And they fear combination there will be the discovery of a centering himself of tenderness of love and that will be his discovery. We can call this the discovery in terms of the image of the sacred marriage the union of. The pair of opposites in their rhotic loving way. Or if it has been a household where the father has been a nothing. No force in the home at all. Where there has been no sense of father or authority and someone of the masculine order whom you can respect. But. A kind of. Mass of. Domestic. Details and feminine concerns the quest will be for a father image and this will be what will be found. The motif not of the Union in marriage. But of the discovery and. Atonement. So to say with the father. Another point. Of problem is when the child has felt himself to be excluded a person with no family let's say or a person who has been treated as though he work outside the family. I've noticed this occasionally when there is a second family a marriage and another family comes off they excluded one of the earlier one is outside. One seeks center and there comes the sense of having found the center of having been the center and being the center. Of Dr.. Perry told me of one case a schizo phrenic who was absolutely cut off. Nobody could communicate with him at all. And this poor new person he drew a little circle for. And he just put his pants in the middle of the circle and Perry said to him you are in the center aren't you aren't you. And this started it. Now that's a very interesting example of. A psychosis at this time in the next to last chapter of langs book The Politics of experience. It is an actual account of psychosis by a adult man who went in and out. And he gives an image of the fourth kind of crisis to come. A sense of great a light. And a sense of a terribly dangerous light to be encountered. Ultimate illumination you might say this is almost the Buddha light or they light the described in the Tibetan Book of the dead. In that work there was a a very vivid account of this ultimate crisis in the psychosis. The man imagines himself to be in a three story house that's a three story universe of the Old Testament. They all look the logical image. He in the middle. Beneath most people those who are not in the run of the quest. In the middle those seated like himself waiting for the illumination you might say waiting for God Dawn and above. The realm of Higher Power and Light. And he said. Life's is a test and an opportunity to learn to make the next step on this joint journey and go up to the light because he says. Everyone has to get to the top. And the creature at the top. Is God and God is a madman. He is mad because he has total knowledge and this is absolutely excruciating. What he knows. That is the image that in Buddhism is called the body stop. That is the image of Christ crucified. That is the image of Prometheus to the rock. That is the image of Loki. Tied to the rock this is they crucified one the one who knows the sufferings of all mankind and life is suffering. It is a monster. It is horrendous. Can you absorb that and say yea to it. That's the final thing. That's the final crisis. And he at this moment had the feeling this is too much. I will explode. And this is a very thrilling passage there he said. I said to myself. I've got to come out of this. He sat on the edge of the bed for 15 minutes simply pronouncing his own name. And he came out of his psychosis. This is the remission when the thing is so terrible. And you aware of where you are a little bit. There is spontaneous remission. If not you will go through and never come back. That is what the yogi seeks who seeks. Release who seeks absolute absorption in the mine as the ultimate questions of ego. But now comes the problem of return. There is a great sense of coming back. One can see an image of this very vivid one in the odyssey of Homer. Where Odysseus has gone down he has gone past the realm of the Lotus Eaters. He's gone through the eye of the Cyclops. He's gone into the realm of elation violists and the realm of depression of the Leicester don't eant and by six say he has been introduced to the underworld and gone past that to the world of the sun. And when he comes to the world of the sun that image of light. The pope smashes and the waters carry him right back home to Penelope. After a little stop off with Calypso for eight years but he finally gets back there. So there comes now a reversal of the whole imagery of the regression. There it was from outside to inside. From time to eternity from eternity to nonbeing. And now it goes from nonbeing to eternity from eternity to time. From past time to this time and back. And what. Is the image now. The images of rebirth. Second birth. A new eagle comes forth. This is an ego that is not bound in on its own little self. It is an ego that is the reflex of the larger self. And carries that was energies of the large. Instinct system into play in relation to the contemporary world. There's no fear you're not a fear afraid of nature or of it's child society which is just as monstrous as nature can't be otherwise wouldn't exist otherwise. And the ego is in harmony with this in accord with it. And these people say life is richer. Life is stronger after this great crisis. They. Thing is to go through it somehow. How one goes through it without going down and cracking up cranking off and and collapsing doesn't mean that you're not allowed to go crazy for a little while. But the thing is not to remain there somehow to come back. Now there's always the danger of what is called inflation. And this is what happens to the psychotic. He identifies himself. With. The mythological image. That trick is to get in relationship to get in play with it let the energy that it carries feed you without identifying with it. To understand that we are all saviors. In our functioning in relation to our friends and to our enemies. We are savior figures but we are not the savior. We are all mothers and fathers but not the mother the father. We are local manifestations of these powers certainly. Look what happens. I teach in a girls college just at that time when girls are beginning to find out that they are girls. And that exists what it does to people for you to walk in the room. Well when these children begin to think this is I say wrong. It's that wonderful thing they're living in that body that's growing up around their little egos that's making all the impression. That little thing living in it saying oh I look what I'm doing. It's very often not very. Let me say impressive. Now to give a little Indian story to clue this little servant. There's a story of a young man who was told by his guru by his teacher you are divine you are want is known as God. Oh what a wonderful thing to be told what a wonderful thing to learn. And he went and meditated on this and found himself one with eternity. Talk to them I see you are it. So. The world is it also so filled elated with this wonderful inspiration. He goes for a stroll down the road. And coming toward him is an elephant with a powerful nature of these beautiful elephants and all painted up and on the. Back is the how dogs some people riding in it on the head is the Mohawk The elephant driver. And the young man walking down the road. The elephant coming in the moat shout Get out of the way. And he thinks I am God. The elephant is God. Should God get out of the way of God. Meanwhile of course. The moment of truth. Is coming along. And these wonderful elephants the elephant just wrapped his truck around this sublime creature and threw him off into the dust. Well he was injured physically but much more deeply spiritually. And he comes back in this battered condition to his guru. The killer sees this coming in Lisa's health. He said What happened to you. But he said You tell me. I face an elephant. Yeah. You told me you are God you are god sister. The elephant is God. Elephant is God. Should God get out of the way of God. Why didn't you listen to the Word of God calling to you from the head of the elephant to get out of the way. You've got to know what world you're moving in at the time. It's one thing to go into bliss. Sure. That's one aspect that it's a Don true aspect it's a reality. It's no fooling. But this is reality too. That Cadillac coming down the way is god awful. And it's a good idea to watch out for the dual as well as. A unified aspect of the divine thing. That's the world we live in. But that little thought. Thank you very much. Tom. He. Was. Professor Joseph Campbell. Thank you. It's nice to hear a good laugh like yours right. You've heard Dr. Joseph Campbell speaking on the topic inward journey schizophrenia and mythology. This was one of the 1970s series of lectures recorded at the great hall of the Cooper Union in New York City by station WNYC. The chairman for the Cooper Union was Johnson a child. This program was distributed by the national educational radio network.