[00:00:00] Mr. Walter Watts: It is my distinct privilege to welcome you to the-the debut of The Greater New York Chapter of EEAA. And by the time you leave here this afternoon, you will also know why this new chapter is very much needed. By the way, if any of you had planned on spending the whole afternoon here, I will have to disappoint you and say that we hope to be outta here in about an hour.

Now, before introducing our next speaker, I wanna recognize the great lady who is the founder of The Greater New York Chapter and the inspiration of those of us who have worked to make this dream come true. And I wonder if I can ask Mrs. Harold Vincent Milligan to stand.
[applause]

[00:00:56] Mr. Watts: Now, for the benefit of anyone who doesn't know her, I will explain that Mrs. Milligan is distinguished for her work and humanitarian causes of all of her adult life and has a list of ti-- of titles as long as my arm, which I'm not gonna repeat. I'm going to mention only one because it-- because it is the key to her personal philosophy of life as well as her keen perceptive-perceptiveness in recognizing unmet needs which will benefit people of all nationalities, races, and creeds.

Mrs. Milligan is president of the Golden Rule Foundation and chose to sit at the foundation's table rather than at the head table, where she rightfully deserves to be. And I believe with her is Mr. Sam Albert, who, uh, wishes to, uh, perform a little act.
[applause]

[00:01:53] Mr. Watts: Mr. Albert.

[00:01:54] Mr. Albert: Welcome indeed, sir.

[00:01:55] Mr. Watts: And thank you very much. Mr. Albert has just made a very generous contribution to support the costs of this luncheon. And, uh, uh, we've all deeply indebted to you, Mr. Albert.
[applause],

[00:02:17] Mr. Watts: About three months ago, a statement by Dr. Howard Brown, the newly appointed commissioner, and administrator of City Health Services, appeared in the New York Times, giving a partial outline of his plans. To those of us who care about our fellow man, these lines stood out. The era of steel and wooden benches and [unintelligible 00:02:41] painted colorless walls that set the somber tone of the city's outpatient facilities and its 19 municipal hospitals, and 28 health centers is about to end.

Individual comfortable chairs and brightly colored decorated walls will be part of the new decor intended to beautify and dignify these formally dismal areas. The beautification of the outpatient facilities is part of the new health services administration's effort to humanize health and medical services in New York City. Dr. Brown's heartening words tell us more about him than any formal introduction I might frame on the basis of his very impressive biography. It is with much plea-- pleasure that I present New York's City's Health Services administrator, Dr. Brown.

[00:03:43] Dr. Brown: Uh, Mr. Watts, distinguished guests, and my coworkers in our crusade for better health for all citizens of New York. I'm very honored to represent the city of New York. I'm very honored to represent Mayor Lindsay. Uh, he is quite sorry that he could not be here today. We talked about it this morning, however, at eight o'clock.
This is an important occasion in our movement toward total health for the whole man. We've now come to that point in history when we must be aware of the fact that anything that prevents any one of our citizens from functioning effectively must be all of our concern. Epilepsy is such a limitation and it's time that we recognized it as such. We all know that the formation of a Greater New York Chapter to work in epilepsy is long overdue. I'm very happy that you've now taken the first steps to meet this need.

I'm glad, and I thank you. As some of you may guess, who read the newspapers with my concern and responsibility for the many problems of New York City's health, and there are many today, I feel like a beleaguered general who, at a critical moment, is getting some fresh reinforcements and help. So I thank you for that. At last, there will be a group of workers who'll be working for improving and helping the problems of epilepsy in New York City. I think more is needed than numbers or a group of people with the name.

There is encouragement that we can move ahead with strength and spirit and the sharing of a burden because it is shared, it is diminished. Uh, as a public official who is struggling with the great problems of New York City and its health services at the moment, I'm heartened and stimulated by the very presence of this group. I believe strongly in the volunteer. The power of the voluntary concept should not and cannot fail.

I just returned a month ago from two days in London, and you may be interested in knowing that there is increasing impetus for voluntary movements such as this in Great Britain because of the need to bring the, uh, top-level talent, the spirit, the ability to innovate that only the voluntary movement can have. I can tell you for both Mayor Lindsay and myself that we're going to do everything we can to preserve and to strengthen the voluntary movement in health.

And we hope to do everything we can to help your program and by helping your program to help the epileptic. I congratulate you then on your enterprise for epilepsy. And as evidence of our faith in you, bring you today the mayor's proclamation. I believe this is the day that not only those of us who are interested in the problems of epilepsy but are interested in strengthening health services for the whole community should remember. Let me read Mayor Lindsay's proclamation.

Whereas there are an estimated 90,000 persons in New York City who have epilepsy, and the true facts regarding epilepsy are still unknown to the general public. And whereas a group of prominent New York citizen headed by leaders from the arts, business, labor, and the social world under the chairmanship of Mr. W. Walter Watts has undertaken to sponsor the formation of a Greater New York Chapter of Epilepsy Association of American to disseminate these facts and to serve, therefore said 90,000 persons with epilepsy and the approximately half million New Yorkers who are their close relatives.

And whereas this sponsoring luncheon is launching its activities with the communication luncheon on October 11th, 1966, before an assembly of prominent New York citizens to whom objectives and services of the new chapter of Epilepsy Association of America will be communicated. Now, therefore, I, John V. Lindsay, mayor of the City of New York, do hereby proclaim October 11th, 1966, as Epilepsy Association of America Day, in New York City, in tribute to The Greater New York City Chapter, and here upon, call upon the citizens to support the work of this much needed voluntary agency. Mr. Watts.
[applause]

[00:09:02] ?Speaker 1: Thank you very much. [inaudible 00:09:03]
[00:09:11] Mr. Watts: Thank you. Thank you very much, Dr. Brown. This proclamation launches a new era in this city's continuing successful cooperation between voluntary and civic leadership in problems of health. And I am sure we all warmly welcome the recognition and the-the support that you and Mayor Lindsay give to our cause. Dorothy Gordon's Youth Forum has been a feature of NBC radio and television for many years and has won the Peabody and Emmy Awards, among numerous other highly prized honors. Ms. Gordon has traveled to many countries abroad to conduct youth forums at the invitations of rulers and in the United States, and industrial as well as educational organizations have asked her to serve as a moderator for their forum. We are fortunate indeed to surround Ms. Gordon with distinguished speakers as participants in our panel this afternoon, making us an all-star feature. There are one or two corrections we must make.

Sidney Liu, the assistant to the director of the community-- of community service programs of New York City Health labor-- New York's City Central Labor Council, will appear in place of Mr. Waters, who was summoned to Washington DC today. Ms. Peggy Wood is confined to bed with laryngitis, and Ms. Ethel Barrymore Colt has graciously consented to take her place on the panel. Now, Dorothy, will you please take over?

[00:10:57] Ms. Dorothy Gordon: Okay, thank you. I'm going to say something about you first. I noticed that on this program, nobody applauded me now, really.
[applause]

[00:11:18] Ms. Gordon: Well, first of all, all the logistics are wrong, as far as I'm concerned because I'm accustomed to where we have a mic for each person. And I don't know how this is going to work out, but I'm going to try something new afterwards. But I do wanna tell you about Mr. Watts because all it says here is, "Presiding, Mr. Walter Watts." And he's known as Wally Watts in RCA as a matter of fact. But he is the group Executive Vice President of RCA. Whatever that means, I don't know. [laughs] But I'm going to ask him to come into the panel. You're going to be a member of the panel.

[00:11:50] Mr. Watts: Oh, I am.

[00:11:50] Ms. Gordon: Yes, [laughter] so yeah. Well, I think the best way to do this, then, since we have to do it in this manner with one microphone, is to ask each member of the panel to make a preliminary statement. And then I'm gonna gather them around me, and they can just roll up their sleeves and fistfight to anything they want.

The first one will be, uh, Dr., um, Maurice. He told me that, although it's spelled M-A-U-R-C-I-C-E, it is pronounced Morris. He's British, uh, -- No, he's an American, but he was British. [chuckles] Maurice Charlton, and you'll see who he is on your program. And we're going to ask him to tell us about epilepsy from the physician's standpoint. [unintelligible 00:12:36] Oh, incidentally, I've asked each one to keep it under two minutes. And we'll watch. [inaudible 00:12:44]

[00:12:49] Mr. Maurice Charlton: Well, uh, Ms. Gordon had written down as my question, what is epilepsy? And, uh, the way I'd like to answer it today is by saying that it's a highly significant, uh, health problem about which a lot more could be done than has hitherto been done. If you read the textbooks of neurology, they'll tell you that one person in 200 is an epileptic. But this means an epileptic in the traditional sense of someone who's bedeviled with seizures throughout their life.

At least one person in 100, I think, has a seizure at some time in their life, for one cause or another, and is, therefore, themselves directly connected with the problem. Now, this is a large number of people, two million in the United States. And, of course, we'd like to know more about the cause of such a common, uh, disease, or symptoms, should we say. But more important, uh, today than the research into the causes of epilepsy is to mobilize what we know already.

Probably 3/4 of patients with epilepsy can be treated to a degree that will render them socially happy and useful human beings. And as physicians, we have to educate medical students, doctors, and so forth to manipulate the drugs or whatever in order to, uh, so to speak, deliver the knowledge that we already have.

But even when that medical knowledge has been delivered, there's, uh, large number of problems concerned with education, employment, and so forth, which I hope that my colleague Dr. Graham and the other panelists will discuss, but the text of my sermon today is that we already know a large amount of which we're not making use and the problem which affects one person in 100 personally, of course, if you can't families, an infinitely greater number of people.

[00:15:00] Ms. Gordon: Thank you very much.
[applause]

[00:15:07] Ms. Gordon: I have a question for you, but I'll save it. Uh, our next speaker will-- is, uh, Dr. Fiona Graham. And I think, uh, I would like to ask you-- where is she? Oh, over here? Would you come over, Please? I would like to ask you, Dr. Graham, to tell us why epilepsy has been a sort of a hush-hush thing, uh-uh, hush-hush in, people have been afraid to talk about it through all the years. Why? Would you, as a psychiatrist, would you tell us this?

[00:15:42] Dr. Fiona Graham: All right. I don't have any one answer for this question, um, I won't say my guess is as good as yours. I think mine's a little better because I've talked [chuckles] to probably more people, um, and from what I've learned in talking to people, um, I will say there are several factors which go into this. One of them is that it's a very frightening experience to be with a person who has a seizure, particularly a grand mal seizure.

Um, here's violence-- violent movement, there is loss of contact with the person who's having the seizure with the outside, but also the outside with the person who's having a seizure, you can tap him on the shoulder and say, "Are you all right? What's all this about?" He won't answer. So you're frightened as well as he. Well, you're frightened he doesn't know what's going on. You're frightened. Um, Consequently, I think there's been a lot of fear.

And, um, in spite of what Dr. Charlton says that we know a great deal, it's not being used. I'd like to stress the other point, there's a great that we don't know yet. We don't know entirely why it happens. Uh, We don't have all the answers. And when we don't have all the answers, we often try to make them up. Um, From the olden days, people used to say, "Well, there's an evil spirit in this person, or she's a witch."

Um, and we're more sophisticated now, but we still come up with reasons such as this, um, even though they sound more sophisticated. Um, And in industry, in schools, and all kinds of social contexts. uh, people prefer to say, "Well, you know, keep that problem away from me. You know, he might do this, or he might do that."

They don't understand, um, and they're afraid. And I think there's still a great deal that we need to know. Uh, there's also a lot that we already know, and, uh, everybody doesn't know it. And I think that we need to educate the people who are living with that epileptics as much as the epileptics themselves, possibly more.

[00:17:52] Ms. Gordon: Thank you very much.
[applause]

[00:17:56] Ms. Gordon: Well, this-this brings us- this brings us to the educational field where we have Mr. J. Maia Lehmann, who is the Assistant Director of the Board of Education, Bureau of education of physically handicapped. And I think before I asked Mr. Lehmann to come to the restroom, I would like to tell it a little experience that I myself had. I, uh, was, uh, conducting a forum, we were going down to Washington, we had going by bus with a group of college press students.

And each one of these young people were editors of their school paper, uh, brilliant young people. And on the bus, one young man had an epi-epileptic seizure. Nobody knew what to do. But as you said, they tap on the shoulder, and the-the young people were wonderful, they went over to help and so forth. And, um, in a very short time, he came-- he got out of this. Uh, I was concerned because I didn't know what would happen on the program since he was a member of the panel.

Uh, we got down to Washington, this boy absolutely had no recollection that he had had the seizure. And, uh, I wasn't going to do anything about it. He went right on the- on the panel, he was excellent. And then I got in touch with the president of the university that he came from and told about that. And the President said he didn't know anything about it, he'd get in touch with other personnel in the university.

Nobody in the university knew that this young man did have epileptic seizures. It was possible that he- that he was, uh, had this, and-and the parents had never notified the university. Nobody knew anything about it. So I think this is a very good time to bring up a representative of the Board of Education. And we might ask him, how much do the school people and the educators know about children who have epilepsy? And there is Mr. Lehmann, please. Oh, you're over here.
[applause]

[00:19:53] Mr. Lehmann: Actually, Ms. Gordon, your story brings us very much in line with our philosophy for physically handicapped children generally. In the city system, we attempt to have physically handicapped youngsters, including those with, uh, epilepsy, as close to the regular class situation as possible. And it's quite possible that the reason the, uh, young men and women on the, uh, uh, bus, uh, responded so naturally to the seizure was that they had been in contact in their regular school program with youngsters who have had seizures from time to time.
In the Board of Education, we attempt to, uh, provide a program for every physically limited child. My particular bureau handles those physically limited children in the normal intellectual range. Now, for that, uh, with the approval of the Department of Health, the youngster who is recommended for, uh, class placement is placed either in a regular class, which is, uh, what is most desirable if the seizures are limited, and if the youngster could function in a regular class or is placed in a special health conservation class, which, uh, provides a modified program somewhat more limited, uh, program, somewhat more support in terms of smaller class size, uh, um, or is if there are a series of recurrent seizures is placed on home instruction.

And I'd say the direction of the school system in terms of, uh, having youngsters who, uh, have, uh, seizures directed back to the regular stream is reflected in some of the figures that I, uh, picked up before coming to the panel. In 1939 there were some, uh, 230 youngsters who were on home instruction who had had seizures. During the past three or four years, the range was somewhere between 60 and 80. Uh, this does not mean these 60 are the same, 60 or 80 that are on each year.
It may mean that if the youngster has recurrent seizures. Uh, on the other hand, it does, uh, provide for the flexibility as soon as the youngster, uh, is, uh, has his seizures controlled medically. And this is where, uh, the extent of the medical progress is reflected in the increase in the numbers of children who are going to school. As soon as, uh, the seizures are controlled based on medical recommendation, the youngster is placed either in the regular class or in the special health conservation classes that we have set up. And I'll join in later.
[applause]

[00:22:42] Ms. Gordon: Thank you very much. Well, um, thus far, we've had, uh, the professional people, and we're coming out to the, uh, the citizens. And I'm going to ask, uh, Ethel Barrymore Colt to tell us how can just people help in this very important area? How can communications of the performing arts, for instance, have they done anything? Do they do anything? Will they do something?

[00:23:13] Ethel Barrymore Colt: As you heard, I am here today as an understudy to Ms. Peggy Wood. The reason she's not here is because she has laryngitis. The only trouble, as you can hear, is the understudy has laryngitis too. [laughter]

Uh, everybody has been asked to keep their remarks to two minutes. I hope my voice lasts two minutes. [chuckles] Actually, the one thing that we haven't talked about today is what the luncheon is about, which is communication. And I am here mostly to talk about how the Living Theater can be used as a tool for communication of ideas. Uh, this is not a new thought.

The theater started as a communication of ideas in ancient Egypt, Greece, the morality plays, and so forth. Through the centuries, the theater was used to communicate to an audience who perhaps couldn't read or write the stories and the problems, and the great religious thoughts of the day. Now, in the last few years, I have been, as is Ms. Wood, associated with an organization called Plays for Living, um, on our board and very active in it.

For instance, uh, Katherine Cornell, [unintelligible 00:24:22], all kinds of people who are theater people, but who are also interested in the community. We have had 34 big national organizations commission plays from us to tell their story to the audience because we firmly believe that live actors in a play.

We only have four or five live actors who can do it on a platform of a room or any place in the world, can tell a story to an audience, which the audience will identify with so much better than all the television programs which you turn off and go to the ice box or the pamphlets, no matter how beautifully written, they do not have this personal impact.

And the very fact that all these organizations have commissioned plays from us again and again, I think, does tell the story. We have, for instance, for health, education, and welfare, we have had five plays commissioned, uh, one a year on various rehabilitation things. And it does work. We have had people in the audience. Um, one of our education plays was about, um, The Green Blackboard was about the pressure of early education.
And somebody in the audience who was the principal of a school, therefore I hope a reasonably intelligent man, [laughs] suddenly went up to one of our actors and shook his finger in his eyes and said, "What do you mean you didn't get the proper education?" Well, he suddenly, he was bawling this poor actor, said, "Well, I was just playing a part." You know, he absolutely had lost all track of the fact.

Where was the play and where was, you know, where was reality and where was the play? Last year, I went all over the country, uh, for Plays for Living, living visit our various chapters. I was in Nashville. And after we had had, uh, two of our plays performed, um, on, uh, for retarded people and on, uh, for mentally retarded children, understanding of the community for these two problems and understanding, for instance, for the re-- for the, uh, retired people, um, understanding of their own problem, which is our whole point, is understanding.

We don't, by the way, try to solve all the problems of the world with a snappy little half-hour play. You know, we have them, for instance, our unmarried mothers and juvenile delinquents, and we don't think we're gonna absolutely, uh, knock this all out by watching a half-hour play. But we do have discussions afterwards, which we hope do lead to understanding of the problem.

Sometimes the discussions are more impassion than the play. In Nashville this day, after we'd had our, um, meetings in the morning, I was taken to lunch, and we went into a big hotel, and I thought naturally that we're just- we're just going to the lunch and dining room. And I was, I sitting into a room where there was, you know, a big luncheon in progress just like this. I saw some red feathers here and there, and I thought, "Oh, how interesting." It is, um, obviously a community fund, United just thing.
It brought me up to the head table like this, sat down next to the chairman. I was eating my, you know, mashed potatoes and peas. And suddenly, halfway through, I heard the chairman say, "Ms. Ethel Barrymore Colt will now deliver the keynote address for the United Funds." [laughter] Nobody had said a word to me about this. Obviously, somebody had goofed. Well, in a panic, a horrible, hideous panic, and this was expected to be a real speech, you know.

I suddenly remembered our volunteer play, a play that was commissioned for, uh, by various organizations, you know, the Red Cross and the American Hospital Association, Junior League, and so forth on the volunteer that somebody brought up just now in the community, why people volunteer. And we had a typical husband who said, "Ah, I these silly women that are running in and out of, uh, meetings all the time, if you want a man to do something, pay 'em." You know?

And, of course, then we had to have a terrible disaster to show what would happen if, you know, what brings all the volunteer organizations in. And I wanna tell you, the day that we premiered this, the American Red Cross, we-we-we had a dam breaking. The day we premiered this, that dam broke out in California. So watch it, [laughs] you know, it was really quite spooky. Uh, anyway, I was [unintelligible 00:28:15]-- well, I'm-- I know I'm being given the signal two minutes.

Uh, I just wanted to finish about this because, at the end, the man says, um-- Well, everything had been taken care of. He said, "It's as if there was a town beneath a town that I didn't know about. All these people who had rushed in, who were trained, who did all these things." And the other person said, "We know that's the town underneath the town of the volunteers of the people who care." And that, I think, is what we find here today, the people who care enough to do something about whatever the problem is of the community. And that's what we're here for today. Thank you.
[applause]

[00:28:56] Ms. Gordon: Um, since you were talking about communications, I'm going to get Mr. Watts to come in on this. So you think of what you're going to say, but not yet. I want to get our labor man first. Um, as you heard Mr. Watts say in his, uh, preliminary introduction that, we're having Sidney Lew, who's assistant to the Director of Community Services Program of New York City. And the most important question I think that we want to pose to you, Mr. Lew-- Come on up here, is, um, whether labor is doing anything to help epileptic people have jobs, are they denied jobs when there is a history? All right, take over.

[00:29:41] Sidney Lew: Well, before I answer this question, I would just like to refer to Ms., uh, Barrymore, who just a minute ago, uh, mentioned the United Community Funds and Chest. Uh, because the president of the, uh, United Community Funds and Chest today happens to be Mr. Joe Byrne, who is the president of the, uh, Communication Workers of America. And this is the-- he is also the, uh, chairman of the Community Services Committee of the ALCIO. And I'll tell him what happened in your case and see what we can do.

[00:30:08] Ms. Gordon: The commission of labor [unintelligible 00:30:09].

[00:30:10] Mr. Sidney: Uh, with that, I would like to say, uh, it has been the-- to answer this question, it has been the policy, uh, of the AFL–CIO, and it does have it in its constitution, to support, uh, these voluntary agencies and-and organizations such as this. Uh, so it is on record. Now, it is our job as community service representatives in the areas, and we have them throughout the country, uh, to cooperate with, uh, groups such as this to get out whatever possible support labor can give. And it has done this in many ways, uh, it has done through communication media, and it also has done it, uh, through, uh, actual hard cash. [crosstalk] interested in both.

[00:30:52] Ms. Gordon: No. No. No. No. My question was, do they get jobs?

[00:30:54] Ethel: Yes, I was-- Right. I was getting down to this, and one of the things we do have to support this, uh- uh-uh, phi-philosophy here is our rehabilitation project which is at the New York City Central Labor Council. And here we work with the handicap, uh, uh, person, uh, whether they be epileptic or not. And we do, uh, ask our local unions throughout the area to help us provide jobs for these people after they have been retrained. And this is the backbone of our hope-- of the Hope program here.

Uh, we recognize this, and we are doing our best, and we have had wonderful cooperation from the many, uh, better than 600 local unions in this- in this area here. So, uh, I hope this has answered your question, Ms. Goodman, and I hope that we, uh, will-- Ms. Gordon, uh, we will have the, uh, honor of working with this group and cooperating with Mr. Waters has asked me to tell you that he will cooperate in any way uh, he see, uh, you see fit. Thank you.

[00:31:49] Ms. Gordon: Well, of course, the only way to--
[applause].

[00:31:53] Ms. Gordon: The best way to see fit is to make sure that young people-- and since I understand that epilepsy is, uh, confine much more to the younger generation that the young people do get jobs. Now you're talking, uh, Ethel talked about, um, communications, and I told Mr. Watts he's coming in on the panel, so you'll come along, Mr. Watts, and get your under two minutes.

[00:32:16] Mr. Watts: Uh, do I get a question?

[00:32:17] Ms. Gordon: Look as a com-- Do you get-- Yes. What does the community--

[00:32:21] Mr. Watts: I have the subject.
[laughter]

[00:32:22] Ms. Gordon: Well, I'll ask you one question.

[00:32:25] Mr. Watts: Yes.

[00:32:26] Ms. Gordon: Uh, I told what your job is at RCA. I don't know what it-- I don't understand it, but I know you're a vice president of the executives group, whatever that means.

[00:32:34] Mr. Watts: I'm the most hated man in America. I'm the fellow who makes color television sets that nobody can get.

[00:32:40] Ms. Gordon: Well, at this moment, you can send me one. I haven't got one. Now-
[laughter]

[00:32:44] Mr. Watts: Not looking for business.

[00:32:46] Ms. Gordon: Um, no. What I would like to ask you is why in your very busy life, and I know how busy everyone at RCA and NBC is, there's Larry Johnson sitting over there who's my immediate chief at NBC program director, and he's-- I know how busy he is, and here he is waiting to get information. Why did you accept the, uh, chairmanship of the Greater New York chapter for epilepsy?

[00:33:09] Mr. Watts: I shall answer.

[00:33:10] Ms. Gordon: Yes.

[00:33:13] Mr. Watts: I've been asked, uh, why I got interested in this, and, uh, I just made a very large loan at a bank to, uh, buy some, uh, uh, shares of RCA stock that I had an opt-option. And about a week later, the-- uh, one of the, um, officials of the bank came up and, uh, said, "Now, we think it would be a nice idea if you did something for Epilepsy." And, uh, I don't know what you call that, but I didn't know anything about epilepsy. And when I listened to the story, I became aware of a very close affinity between the business that I am in and which I earned my living and this disease.

And I became fascinated with it. And I have for several years been, uh, and I want to tell you what that is. Now, uh, we-we-- I'm going to steal, uh, uh, from a previous speaker's, uh, line. We've called this a communications luncheon. And I wanna say what it is-is it that we wish to communicate. And it's been very simply written for us by our public relations people, the Ted Bates Agency, in about three words. Epilepsy is not contagious. It is not harmful to others, and it can be controlled in a majority of cases.

Four out of five respond to treatment. And as I listened to the doctors and the speakers like we have heard here today, this is what sunk into my consciousness. When your TV or radio spits and crackles, or the picture has temporary jitters, it is generally caused by static or an over surge of electricity in some circuit.

Medical science more and more believes that epilepsy is a result of some kind of a surge of electrical or chemical forces or a combination of both in the nervous system that temporarily upsets the brain. It is definitely not a seizure by the devil. The victim is not to be feared, shunned, or hidden. We didn't get syphilis under controlled by hiding it. We found out what caused it, encouraged its victims to come forth and be helped.
That is what we must do with epilepsy. The first task is to batter down the iron curtain of ignorance. And that is the reason we called it a communications luncheon. And this message must be delivered to every village, hamlet, and town. And that parallel between what goes on in the upset of a human body and what goes up, uh, on-- in the upset of one of our products is the thing that has me interested. Does that answer your question?
[applause]

[00:36:19] Ms. Gordon: I think so, yes, very much. Now-now my essential function in life is to moderate. Which means that I get a group of people together, usually the youth, but now I have the adults haven't helped me and, um, let them have a free for all. Now, I think that many things have come up that are interrelated, and I think I'm gonna take about 10 minutes. And since we don't have a regular table with microphones for each one, gather around me. Let's stand up here and have a, uh, and see what we can get out of this. Um, is there a microphone over there?

[00:36:57] Speaker 2: Yes.

[00:36:57] Ms. Gordon: Oh, there is one that's working?

[00:36:59] Speaker 2: One that's attached to the, uh, [crosstalk]

[00:37:02] Dr. Charlton: Is this working?

[00:37:03] Ms. Gordon: Well now, Dr. um, Char-Charlton, you come up here, please, because I think that several challenging questions have been thrown out to you. And I'd like you to say-- and say something, anyone else who wants to come into it, just let me know. Will you? All right, Dr. Charlton.

[00:37:21] Dr. Charlton: I know what's, uh, agitating Ms. Gordon's mind, and that is, um, something she read in the New York Times on Sunday about--

[00:37:28] Ms. Gordon: Oh, yes, I'm going to tell about that. You wait a moment.

[00:37:31] Dr. Charlton: Let her tell you about that.
[laughter]

[00:37:32] Ms. Gordon: Well, because I have asked the question, is there a cure? And I have been told that they-they are-- that epileptics can be given me-- uh, medication, right?

[00:37:44] Dr. Charlton: Mm-hmm.

[00:37:45] Ms. Gordon: Stand up here. Don't sit down. Um.

[00:37:48] Dr. Charlton: Correct.

[00:37:49] Ms. Gordon: What do they get, Pills-

[00:37:50] Dr. Charlton: That's right.

[00:37:51] Ms. Gordon: -sedation, things like that?. Well, I did read in the New York Times, and I imagine many people did read the New York Times, I hope, last Sunday. Uh, but, um, this immediately struck me, and it came from Durham, North Carolina, and said, "Brain wave test may aid epileptic." Now, do you want to talk about that?

[00:38:10] Dr. Charlton: Well, I can say, uh--

[00:38:12] Ms. Gordon: They probe into the brain and find the scar
tissue. Is that the general idea, and can they remove it?

[00:38:17] Dr. Charlton: Well, um, in regard to what Mr. Watts said, um, the current idea of the epileptic fit is that it largely consists of an abnormal electrical discharge in the brain. But it does not mean that this springs from a brain which is abnormal in any, uh, gross sense. You know, that there's a huge scar or tumor or something that would interfere with the patient's other function.

And quite often, um, chemical means of control by drugs will stop these discharges without having to resort to surgery or without there being any scar. So, um, it is true that the, uh, epileptic discharge is electrical in nature, but that does not mean that the, um, cure is surgical or electrical. Uh, the, uh, article you referred to is-is concerned a very special group of cases.

And, uh, that work is going on in many places, not just in Durham, North Carolina. Of course, you know, [chuckles] uh, I have nothing particular against newspapers, but, uh, we are all, uh, have our own patriotism, I suppose. And many centers are exploring these methods, but it is essentially an electrical, uh, disorder. But the cure is a chemical one at moment.

[00:39:38] Ms. Gordon: Thank you very much. Uh, I, of course, if I had a table and we were all together, we could have an interplay of thought, but it seems to me that, uh, since I-- we don't want to carry this too long, um, it might be interesting. I'm sure that all of you sitting there must have questions that you want to addre-address yourself to the members of this panel. And this, perhaps, might be a better way of getting at the theme, which is 'A Need for Greater Understanding.' So if there's anyone who has a question, would you? Yes.

[00:40:16] Audience Member: Could you kindly explain the relationship of management-- Uh, we've heard from Labor, we've heard from the physicians, can you tell me how American management feels toward employing the epileptic?

[00:40:27] Ms. Gordon: Now, who's the manager?

[00:40:27] Audience Member: [crosstalk]

[00:40:28] Ms. Gordon: Yes. That's the point that I was trying to get to. That's up to you, Mr. Lew.

[00:40:37] Mr. Sidney: Uh, we have been working many, uh, instances very close with management on, uh, employment of the handicapped. Uh, we have worked through the, uh, the DVR, Division of Vocational Rehabilitation, very closely. And in many instances, we have, uh, taken them to the plant, introduced them to the employers, and we have had a very good relationship in employing a lot of these people. Now, in many instances, they have responded admirably. Uh, I don't know offhand any of that haven't as yet. Now, I don't know whether or not it was the persuasion on our part or what, but really we have had very good cooperation in this area. And, uh, I, uh, don't know what to add, uh, I, 'cause I do not- do not speak for management, uh, other than, uh, the Labor's involvement with management in these, in-in this type of program.

[00:41:25] Ms. Gordon: Would you want to say something about that yourself as an industrialist?

[00:41:29] Audience Member: I'm impressed with the fact that the epileptic, in my experience, does not need rehabilitation. He needs employment. He needs training from a basic standpoint. It's not necessarily the matter of the union or the matter of management to do so, it's a matter of he securing education and training. Once he has this background, there's no reason why, uh, four-fifths of all epileptics cannot be, uh, successfully employed and gainfully employed. And it's our problem here in this association to train management, to train all peoples to understand that the epileptic is employable and that he should be employed and can be employed [inaudible 00:42:01].

[00:42:02] Ms. Gordon: Representing management, Mr. Watts--
[applause]
Representing management, Mr. Watts, do you want to say something about that?

[00:42:14] Mr. Watts: I'll-- uh, the biggest problem confronting my industry and many others today is lack of trained people to do a job. We have just doubled in the last year the size of our facilities to produce the products we make. And our biggest problem was not in building the facilities, not in designing the equipment that we were gonna make, but it was in hiring and training people. And I think that a pool of, uh, trained people and an understanding on the part of the management of the things that you're talking about would, uh, be a very helpful thing. And this is a communications job, again, that we're not getting over to enough managements. There are a few enlightened ones, uh, that are doing things in this field, but we need to get this-this farther down the line that, uh, that this is a perfectly controlled thing and that these are employables who can do not only as good but a better job than most workers.

[00:43:27] Ms. Gordon: Well, that'll be part of your job as the president of The Greater New York Chapter. Um, isn't that so? [chuckles]

[00:43:34] Mr. Watts: I think that's our- on the list.
[laughter]

[00:43:37] Ms. Gordon: Uh, have the other questions. Yes.

[00:43:39] Audience Member: I'll ask Dr. Graham whether the epileptic might be his own, uh, worst enemy or best enemy as his attitude towards working and-and can you get him out this feeling that maybe he needs little thing apart, doesn't dare take a chance in working and being thought of as a queer sort of person when he has [inaudible 00:43:55]-

[00:43:58] Ms. Gordon: Would you come up here [unintelligible 00:43:59]?

[00:43:59] Audience Member: -[inaudible 00:43:59] you know what I mean.

[00:44:02] Dr. Graham: Yes. This is very frequently in the case. Uh, I think it's a two-way thing nevertheless, though, that, uh, the theme is communication. Uh, there's a difficulty in communication between the employer and the uh, the epileptic himself. For instance, there are times when an epileptic needs to forego an insurance policy because he's an extra liability. Why should the employer take it on? Uh, if the epileptic stands in his pride and won't, then he is his own worst enemy. Um, if he lies about it and he has a seizure, and the employer's gonna be mad and fire him. These kinds of things, um, there is a need for understanding on both sides, both the epileptic to understand the problems the employer has in taking him on and vice versa.

[00:44:49] Ms. Gordon: Does that answer your question?
[00:44:50] Audience Member: Yes.
[00:44:51] Ms. Gordon: Yes. Any other questions?
[00:44:54] Audience Member: As an association, you say you can't get insurance and health cover. Is there's something to be done, it needs to be on this management union, and maybe get over this thing if it is done in patients and is curable-

[00:45:05] Ms. Gordon: Mr. Lew, I [crosstalk]--

[00:45:06] Audience Member: -possibly working just with insurance and health plan people to get them to accept an epileptic as a normal.

[00:45:11] Ms. Gordon: Mr. Lew, I think that would be your question.

[00:45:15] Mr. Sidney: Well, let me say this. The, uh, uh, health plans and I am not too familiar with it, although we do have, uh, many of our health plan- health plan administrators that, uh, have worked with our program. Uh, but on the whole, what we have done is to try to do an educational job, uh, on the not only on the employer as- but the union official as well. Uh, this must be done, and this is our role, and this is what we have been doing. Uh, I don't know how to really answer other than to say that we have staff people out in the field, and their sole responsibility is to, uh, orientate labor and have Labor, in turn, do whatever it can in-in-in cooperation with management, uh, to employ the handicapped, whether it be the epileptic or not. So, uh, I don't know if this answers your question. I don't think I could add much more to it at this point.

[00:46:07] Ms. Gordon: Well, Mr.- Mr. Lehmann wants to continue on that, would you?

[00:46:14] Mr. Lehmann: I'm interested in the fact that this is, uh, we're dealing with communication and understanding in this sense. Uh, in the school system, we try to communicate the feeling that we have toward handicapped children by getting them as close to the regulars, the regular classes, the regular school situation as close as possible. We have no special school for handicapped children as such or epileptic children as such. All of our, uh, classes are attached to regular schools as special units or regular classes that may be- or-or special classes that may be included in regular schools.

The reason I make this point is that as we talk about, uh, the, uh, the effect of management upon, uh, employment of epileptics, the effect of Labor, uh, on the employment of lepo-- epileptics, or the-the question of how the epileptic, uh, epileptic individual sees himself is that the expression of management must be in providing jobs. The expression of Labor must be in seeing that handicapped individuals of all types actually get into the unions. The verbalization is a simple one, but the expression of your belief, uh, comes up only in terms of how labor channels it into the reality of their, uh, union acceptance, management channels it into the reality of job opportunities. The verbalization is simple. The-the, uh, expression of it in terms of, uh, of how this is carried out, uh, is reflected by the actual number of jobs, the actual number of opportunities that handicapped, uh, individuals are-are given.

[00:48:01] Ms. Gordon: Thank you. Now, uh, I think we'll take two more questions because they do-- there's a question way back there, Dr. Frank.

[00:48:07] Dr. Frank: It's very encouraging to hear that four out of five having help. Doesn't the association have a program for that little person who cannot be helped?

[00:48:16] Ms. Gordon: Well, Dr. Charlton, I actually think that question would be addressed to you.

[00:48:20] Dr. Charlton: Yes. I think this is, um, an interesting question which, uh, is true of all, uh, medical treatment. People say how many can be cured? Now this figure of four out of five or three out of four means people who have such a-a reduction in the number of their attacks that they have no significant problem from a medical point of view with epilepsy. That does mean- does not mean that the other quarter not helped at all.

Um, medicine has more functions than to totally cure diseases. It can relieve pain, make people happy, and other things too. So that remaining quarter, though they may not be cured, can be helped. And I think the, uh, figure of four out of five, three out of four means, uh, cured and not helped, and the others may well be helped. There are, uh, some very tough problems, uh, that we have not, uh, licked. I wouldn't deny that. But the fact that they're not licked in their entirety does not mean that they're not helped to-to some extent.

[00:49:29] Ms. Gordon: And, uh, another question. Yeah, and oh, there was a lady back there, we'll take.

[00:49:34] Audience Member: [unintelligible 00:49:34] question except since this is a meeting about communications, but I wanted to clarify with management, this concept of rehabilitation, you said, "These people do not need rehabilitation, they need to be trained and given a job." And I wonder if he isn't [inaudible 00:49:53] vocational rehabilitation and such. Uh, and perhaps this is where management might play a greater role in assisting with vocational rehabilitation and giving people jobs maybe, uh, on a basis not totally competing with regular workers, but maybe over a shorter time period or something like that.

[00:50:18] Ms. Gordon: We got you.

[00:50:19] Audience Member: We are [unintelligible 00:50:20] under adequate medical control and [unintelligible 00:50:24] with anyone else. The same with education and training. We have to go back to the schools. The attitude taken by you, dear sir, is quite correct in that you can take the epileptic guy and train him properly in association with others, we put him under medical control. This child can develop with the use of [unintelligible 00:50:42] and compete on an even scale with anyone else [unintelligible 00:50:45]. It's not a matter of vocational training per se. It is a matter of putting a stand with this child because that sort of training, which he chooses as his life's work.

He can be a physician. He can be a businessman. He can be a technician. It can be anything that he or she wishes to do. There is no interference to the function of the brain. It's clearly not a function of the brain. And if he has this [unintelligible 00:51:07], This is not a matter of rehabilitation. It's a matter of fundamental initial training, and he becomes a part of the society from the very beginning. And this is what we have to teach. This is what we have to put forward, that this is not an unusual individual if he is handled properly from the very beginning, so [unintelligible 00:51:29
]
[00:51:34] Ms. Gordon: Thank you very much.
[applause]

[00:51:35] Ms. Gordon: Um, I think we have a question. Would you face us, and so that I'd know whom-- Yes.

[00:51:42] Audience Member: Uh, to further what this gentleman just said. Uh, I can give you a concrete example of exactly how a sufferer of epilepsy can work in, uh, to got along with people. About eight years ago, I opened a factory in Tennessee in a small town, and one of the, uh, members of the Chamber of Commerce who lived in that particular town--
[00:52:03] Ms. Gordon: Pardon me just a moment. Can everybody hear you?

[00:52:05] Audience: No.

[00:52:05] Ms. Gordon: No. Well, there's a microphone right over there. Would you talk into that?

[00:52:10] Audience Member: Uh, one of the members of, uh, the Chamber of Commerce who lived in that particular town asked me if I could please employ his daughter, who suffered from epilepsy. And, uh, I said I would discuss it with our factory manager. He was very apprehensive, but I insisted that he did employ her. After she worked there about, uh, oh, just about two days, she had a seizure. When she did, she disrupted the entire section that she worked and everybody got frightened. Everybody, you know, was looking at her, and nobody did any work.

And he called me in New York, and he said, you know, he'd like to let the girl go because, uh, he didn't know how often this would happen, but it would be disrupting. I said, let her work and see what happens. As time went on, everybody in that section and everybody in the plant got accustomed to this. And about three years later I had an occasion to bring some people down to the plant, and this same girl had a seizure while we were there. And there were about four men with me. And they were all amazed that everybody stayed at their work and hardly paid any attention to what had happened there except the one who was assisting her. So it-- I think it proves that uh, if-if there is some understanding with these people that they can work and that the people around them will become accustomed to it and accept it.

[00:53:43] Ms. Gordon: There are nice people.

[00:53:44] Audience Member: Oh, yes.
[applause]

[00:53:48] Ms. Gordon: Well, let's see now, um, back there, I was gonna have two questions since you're also interested why. Well, uh, continue.
[00:53:56] Audience Member: I would like to make a remark to the gentleman who answered my colleague on my right here a minute ago about [unintelligible 00:54:03] vocational rehabilitation [inaudible 00:54:06]. Now, about all of the [unintelligible 00:54:09] and people have said this afternoon may or may not be true as right of now. But 20 years ago, these were not the facts at all. A child 20 years ago who is now 25 or 26 and is excluded from, uh, employment in competitive labor because he was excluded for 20 years from education and other, uh, rehabilitation facilities definitely needs vocational rehabilitation at this point to put him in a favorable position with his age and peer group.
[00:54:51] Ms. Gordon: Well, this is a very highly selected group, and of course, the big question that comes up is, what about the general public? I presume that this is the purpose of the, um, of the organization. Am I right, Mr. Watts?

[00:55:03] Mr. Watts: Right.

[00:55:04] Ms. Gordon: I think, is there anybody who member of the panel who would like to say something before I ask Mr. Watts to bring the whole session to a close? Uh, yes, Dr. Graham.

[00:55:20] Dr. Graham: I'd like to say a word about this last question because I agree very much with the last speaker that, um, the epileptic very often does need rehabilitation. Another word c-- one could use is detoxification. You know, if he's received, uh, uh, no response for 20 years, he's no at school, no for job, no for the other, he doesn't wanna try.

[00:55:41] Ms. Gordon: Wait-- And pardon me just a moment. What do you mean by rehabilitation? Just what is the process of rehabilitation?

[00:55:47] Dr. Graham: He has gotta be given hope to try again. He's gotta be given encouragement, he's gotta be given more than just a job. If you offer him a job, he'll say, "I can't do it." He's so sure of being kicked out.

[00:55:57] Ms. Gordon: Well, the family hasn't come into this thing this afternoon at all, and I think this is a very important area. Uh, does the family-- How much is the family being trained to handle this situation?

[00:56:07] Dr. Graham: The family very often contribute to this. They are ashamed of having an epileptic. They hide him. They make it even more difficult for him to get education. Uh, they try to make him mix in social groups where he can't for one reason or another, and they add to the problem. So the family needs education as much as everybody else. Um, this is a basic beginning point.

[00:56:30] Ms. Gordon: Thank you very much. Um, I'm gonna ask each member of the panel quickly. Mr. Lehmann, did you wanna add anything?

[00:56:36] Mr. Lehmann: I don't [unintelligible 00:56:36]

[00:56:37] Ms. Gordon: Um, Ethel. Ms. Colt.

[00:56:40] Ethel: It seems to me that the entire thing comes down to what the last speaker said. Education. Education of the family, education of the community, education of the management, who are not all as enlightened as these remarkable people we have today. Uh, I know because I work with them. The government has all kinds of wonderful rehabilitation, uh, vocational rehab programs. I'm sure they have some for the epileptic. All these also help the family.

I mean, they work with the family in so many of these things, and I think that the most important thing really is the education of the community so that then the family won't be ashamed of having the, uh, epileptic child because the community will understand. And as-as the, um, because I understand there are all sorts of restrictive laws too, so that, you know, in various states about insurance and driving and so forth, some of the very archaic laws. So it seems to me the great thing is the education, the communication of all this to the biggest possible, uh, audience, the public in general, and I hope that's what we're all here for.

[00:57:39] Ms. Gordon: It is. Dr. Charlton?
[applause]

[00:57:44] Dr. Charlton: Well, uh, all I would like to say is to wish the organization a long and successful career.

[00:57:50] Ms. Gordon: That's a very important statement and which is a very good time, un-un-unless you wanna say something, Mr. Lew. Well, this is a very good time to bring our presiding officer and the president of the organization to the microphone. Mr. Watts.
[applause]

[00:58:10] Mr. Watts: Thank you very much for your- for your patience and your interests, and I am sure that I speak for everyone here when I say that this has been a most interesting and highly entertaining experience, enlightening as well to all of us, and we're grateful to Ms. Gordon and to each of our panel participants for contributing to our knowledge of epilepsy and the problems of epileptic persons.
It is our hope that the new chapter will find solutions to many of the problems of troubled people with epilepsy in the metropolitan area who need guidance. Fortunately, we start with many friends among the club women in this area as both the New York State and the New York City Federation of Women's Clubs voted in 1965 on mis-- on motion of Mrs. uh, Dorothy Strayer-Premier, a past president of both organizations to cooperate with ep- the Epilepsy Association of America in its work on behalf of persons with epilepsy. Is, uh, is Mrs. uh, uh, Strayer-Premier here? Would you rise and be recognized?
[applause]

This gathering-- Thank you very much. This gathering of the Greater New York chapter of the Epilepsy Association is not by any means the initial effort in this study to do something about this misunderstood problem. Several organizations have done splendid work over the years for this cause. And may I ask you now to meet Mrs. Ethel Clyde, who founded in the early 1940s, the Association for the Control of Epilepsy. She honors us with her presence, and we shall call on her in the future for advice and counsel. Will you please stand, Mrs. Clyde?
[applause]

Now this, the EAA nationally represents the merger of the American Epilepsy Federation of Boston, the National Epilepsy League of Chicago, and the United Epilepsy Association of New York City. Negotiations are underway to complete a unified national organization, uh, by bringing together the EAA and the one remaining other large organization working in this field.

A dedicated group here in New York of citizens from commerce and industry has volunteered each year for many years to solicit funds for support and research into the causes, the control, and the cure of epilepsy, to provide the funds for consultation with the victims of the illness, to develop programs aimed at helping community effort in coping with the local problems of epilepsy. To provide professional education and training grant is, uh, a representative of [unintelligible 01:00:56] Mr. Pinkham in the room.

Is there a-- Well, I will then say this that if you have not read this detailed program, a copy should be in the hands of all of you who are interested because it outlines in the usual wrapped-up fashion of a professional public relations and promotion organization a step-by-step approach to how we go about solving this problem. Well, from the people in this room, we will ask for volunteers who will work on public relations committees, financial advisory committees, entertainment and public events committees, membership committees. We're gonna call on you for help in these matters. We solicit your voluntary offers to serve and any advice and counsel you can offer.

And with that, I am going to, uh, wrap it up, and I now present to you the Reverend Dr. Nathan A. Perilman, chief rabbi of-- I'm sorry. Uh, Reverend Dr. Nathan Perilman, chief rabbi of Temple Emanu-El, who had planned to be with us to pronounce the benediction, was called upon to officiate at a service in the temple at this hour, and we are pleased to have his colleague Dr. Ronald B. Sobel with us to give the benediction. Dr. Sobel.
[01:02:29] Dr. Sobel: Almighty and all-merciful God, long centuries ago, one of thy faithful servants cried out from the depths of his heart in prayer saying, "Heal me, O God, and I shall be healed." In a spirit not unlike thine ancient servant, we here assembled cry out from the depths of our hearts and praise and pray that ours will be the determination to bring restored health to so many of thy children. Grant us, O Lord, the strength to fulfill this work with dedication and courage so that, in some measure, our lives will bring the victory of health to those who are so desperately in our need. May the time not be distant when the afflicted shall turn to us and say with complete confidence, "Heal us, and we shall be healed." This is our prayer, O God, as we take leave of each other. Blessed were we in our coming, and blessed shall we be in our going forth. Amen.
[background conversations]
[01:04:20] [END OF AUDIO]

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