( Seth Wenig / AP Photo )
First, NYC Mayor Eric Adams reflects on his first 100 days in office, and talks about how his administration has dealt with crime and public safety, homelessness and vaccine mandates so far, plus reacts to the brand new New York State budget's changes to bail reform.
Then, Elizabeth Kim, reporter who covers mayoral power for the People and Power team at Gothamist and WNYC, debriefs the conversation with the mayor and shares her takeaways.
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Brian Lehrer: Brian Lehrer on WNYC. Mayor Adams will join us in a few minutes as he approaches his 100th day in office. Also as he approaches Yankee stadium because I'm told he'll be in the car on the way to Yankee's opening day in the Bronx. He'll call in once he's safely seated and on route, we are told. Meanwhile, we'll talk to WNYC and Gothamist Elizabeth Kim, who covers the mayor. Hi Liz. Welcome back to the show.
Elizabeth Kim: Hi Brian, how are you?
Brian Lehrer: Good. Before we even get to the mayor, let me ask you about your latest story on Gothamist just out today called DC-based dark money nonprofit funds campaign against Malliotakis. That's Nicole Malliotakis of Staten Island, New York City's only Republican in Congress. When we hear the term dark money, it usually refers to Republican-leaning groups backed by corporate interests. What's this group targeting Malliotakis, and what does the phrase dark money mean there?
Elizabeth Kim: This is a group that is called Unrig Our Economy. Like you said, they're targeting Malliotakis and also Republicans in general on the economy. It's been linked to another group called The Hub Project that's run by a former Obama administration official. In 2018, the New York Times reported that this group had launched several campaign efforts across the country to target vulnerable Republicans in Congress. At the time, they were on track to spend $30 million.
Dark money essentially refers to the fact that because as these groups are registered as so-called social welfare nonprofits, they do not have to require that their donors disclose their names. I think at the time, it was considered eye-opening because you're right, we often associate dark money with Republicans, but as we see, that's certainly not the case. This group is prepared to spend at least a million dollars against Nicole Malliotaki.
Brian Lehrer: More to come of course, on all the congressional races as the midterm election year progresses. That scene and a number of others in our area will be important to deciding which party controls Congress and will cover the local races intensely, but onto the mayor, as we wait for his arrival. How's he been reacting to the state budget agreement that governor Hochul announced last night in terms of its impact on the city that he runs?
Elizabeth Kim: I haven't heard his interviews this morning and I'm looking forward to what he has to say to you, but from what I've read, other reporters are saying that he wants to wait for all of the details to be finalized, but he is very satisfied with the fact that the governor and the legislature reached a deal to revise bail reform. That's clearly a win for the mayor, especially given how opposed the leaders in the state legislature were to these changes and it really speaks to the leverage he has with the governor.
Brian Lehrer: As Adams approaches a hundred days in office, how would you say his approval ratings are so far? There's been so much coverage from right, from left, from whatever perspective on his approaches to crime in particular. That seems to be the centerpiece of his administration so far.
Elizabeth Kim: Yes. There was a recent Siena poll that found 61% of New Yorkers giving him a favorable job review. That's pretty good, but at the same time the pollster pointed out that the data showed that his support wasn't particularly deep, meaning that a majority of New Yorkers said that while they thought the mayor was doing a good job, they were uncertain about the direction of the city.
Myself and members of the WNYC and Gothamist newsroom, we recently fanned out across the city to gather impressions from New Yorkers. This is totally unscientific, but it really did back up a lot of that survey in that a lot of people are still very concerned about public safety. They're happy that the mayor is focusing on crime, but they're unsure about whether this will bring about the change they want to see in their communities.
Brian Lehrer: There was also a big survey that you reported on of New York City residents on specifics of what they want on public safety, which found among other things, that Black and white New Yorkers prioritize certain things to enhance safety, but Asian Americans slightly different things. How would you describe the results of that survey?
Elizabeth Kim: Well, for one thing, that survey was historically large. 62,000 New Yorkers responded to that survey. I think that the results really lined up with what specific groups of New York City residents are saying. Overall, people polled, said that policing was actually not their highest priority when it came to making the city or making themselves feel safer in their neighborhoods. Instead, it was building affordable housing and tackling homelessness, followed by sending mental health responders instead of police when someone appears to be in a crisis, but it did break down differently by race and income.
Low-income Black and Asian New Yorkers tended to prioritize having additional police more than those other choices. That basically does match up with what we're hearing in those neighborhoods. Poor Black neighborhoods have disproportionately been victims of violent crime, and in the wake of the pandemic, Asian New Yorkers have experienced a wave of what many say is racialized violence.
Brian Lehrer: Is there a relationship between those different findings on public safety by the various demographics you just cited and mayor Adams' approval?
Elizabeth Kim: I haven't seen those demographics parsed out in a survey. What I would say is that on the ground, New Yorkers care about very tangible things. Things that they can see. Do I see more police officers? Do I feel safe riding the subways? I think that some of these other discussions about bail reform, it does make an impression because people do read the headlines, but I don't know that people are that well versed in it. What does the mayor want? What does the state legislature want? I would say that in general, when you're talking to everyday New Yorkers, they're talking about everyday things that they're experiencing in their lives.
Brian Lehrer: The mayor has done some things that are controversial on the left, like advocating bail law changes, and some things that are controversial on the right, like extending the mass mandate for two to four-year-olds and most in-person workers. Looks like he might have made a little news on the mask mandate for toddlers on another media outlet this morning, I think on 1010 WINS, he said something like he hopes to lift it in the next week, but he's at the mercy of his health officials.
Elizabeth Kim: Right. It was very interesting that he actually gave that timeline because we're seeing cases rise. On the one hand, he's saying it's totally up to my health experts, and on the other hand, he's leaving hope for those families who really want those masks off and they really do want those masks off because they've been protesting the mayor at every appearance he makes about it. By saying a week, that's just an interesting decision to say that.
Brian Lehrer: All right, Liz, thanks a lot. We'll talk to you on the other side of this conversation and with us now, as he approaches a hundred days in office on Sunday, mayor Eric Adams, who I'm told is in the car on the way to opening day Yankee stadium. Hi, Mr. Mayor, welcome back to WNYC.
Mayor Eric Adams: Hey, how are you? I just heard the tail end of the conversation. First, we are in a state of where we don't lean into facts and we lean into the conclusion. I'm not protest throughout the city. Eight, nine people show up and I'm used to being yelled at. I'm used to being spit at, I'm used to being called names. I was a cop for 22 years for God's sake. [laughs] I am as thick skin as you could be. I know people are dealing with the stress of COVID. I got it.
I know of people are afraid of losing their homes, their jobs, they want mask off children. Those are the issues we're facing. This is the job I signed up for and I'm ready to make the tough decisions and take the criticism that comes with it. We will protect New Yorkers, and that's not always enjoyable. You know what I say all the time, we have 8.8 million New Yorkers, 30 million opinions. The same body of people who say they want something one way, go around the corner, you're going to get another group saying it again in a different way.
Brian Lehrer: Did we get the fact right at least on what you said on another station earlier about that the mask mandate for the toddlers might be lifted in a week or so, but it depends on the new Omicron?
Mayor Mayor Eric Adams: Yes. The new Omicron. Remember we made a plan months ago based on what we get in a series of metrics, hospitalizations, deaths, increase in cases. The medical team came together and they said, "Once we get to these different levels, we will start peeling back some of the restrictions." We wanted to peel back on Monday for masks on two to four years old. I want them off. I'm one of the biggest advocates on my morning calls, but my doctors are saying, "Eric, here's how we have to move forward." Remember, this is how we got here, Brian. [chuckles] The reason we are opening and functioning as a city is because we did things in a meticulous way and I'm not going to be reckless with the economy and the safety and the health of the children and families in the city.
Brian Lehrer: Now, do I have it right that you're on your way to opening day in the Bronx right now?
Mayor Eric Adams: Yes, I'm just leaving a series of events, and then I'm going to head to Albany, to continue to push for the reforms that we need throughout the next two days, and then I'm going to head off to Washington DC to deal with this crime that we're doing. No one is going to work harder for New Yorkers like I am going to work for New Yorkers. That's what they expect from me, and I'm going to live up to that expectation.
Brian Lehrer: I know as a Queens boy that you're a Mets fan. Will you be rooting for the Red Sox today?
Mayor Eric Adams: [laughs] No, I'm a constant Mets fan. I still have memories of being with my family in 1969 when they won the World Series, I'll continue to be rooting for the New York Mets.
Brian Lehrer: No, but when you're at Yankee Stadium today, they're playing the Red Sox. You can root for the Yankees too.
Mayor Eric Adams: I'm on the Subway Series. Let's keep the money right in New York. A championship team brings millions of dollars in revenue, it hires the restaurant rookies and everyone that feeds off of the economy from tourism. We want the Yankees and Mets in the World Series.
Brian Lehrer: There you go. I was just playing with you, but on a serious note and back to the vaccine mandates, you lifted the vaccine mandate for the New York athletes so it's a level playing field with the visiting teams. Did you consider doing what Canada does and not letting the visiting players in if they're unvaccinated? That would be another way to level the playing field without giving the athletes special treatment over other workers.
Mayor Eric Adams: Think about this for a moment, people look at the athletes and they say, "These million-dollar guys." No, what they miss is the performers in January and late December, a group of performance poets, the top players, saxophonists came to me and they stated that "Eric, we pay taxes in New York and because we live in New York, we were penalized by rules that I said back when I was mayor-elect that the rule was unfair." I told them I could not lift it right now because the numbers were too high.
We have to stabilize the last variant. We did so. Then part of our rollout plan included leveling the playing field for those low-wage performers that is often being ignored in this entire conversation of equaling the playing field. I did not want to do what Canada did because I want people to come here and feed into our tourism industry, multibillion-dollar industry, that is continually to be one of the most important parts of handling of what we are dealing with our economy back up and operating.
Brian Lehrer: Sunday is day 100. I saw you say this morning on TV that you talk like you know but you listen like you don't know, which I think is a very emotionally intelligent way to approach life. Let me ask you, what have you learned in these 98 days that is surprising you as you listen to New Yorkers.
Mayor Eric Adams: Just the wisdom, the commitment to great ideas that are out there in our city. We just did an amazing one of the largest surveys in history. We partner with a nonprofit and we listen to New Yorkers on the ground in their communities and ask them what they want. I am just really blown away how every day New Yorkers just have great ideas on how to fix the common problems in their communities. There's not a one-size-fits-all.
What is needed in Bensonhurst is different from Brownsville but there are some common denominators. Public safety, mental health, affordable housing continued to resonate throughout the entire city. We're going to lean into those issues as we recover as a city. I am just really pleased at the energy of New York and the thumbs-up sign that they're giving me. Listen, they know it's been 100 days, I have to turn the city around, but I think they appreciate my dedication and commitment from sunup to sundown, and meeting the sun again in the morning to get this job done.
Brian Lehrer: One of the things in the news, of course, is that you've been shutting down encampments with homeless people, and one of them, city workers spent about seven hours trying to clear out an encampment in the East Village according to our reporting, where a group of homeless people were refusing to leave. I want to play with a 30-second clip of one of those people with an outreach worker on what the person wants if you're going to kick them out of where they feel safe. Listen.
Speaker 1: I spend three years getting stuffed back into another shelter waiting while everybody said, "No, they won't rent to me. It's not going to happen."
Speaker 2: What would it take to get you off the street.
Speaker 1: An apartment.
Speaker 2: That's simple. Pretty simple.
Speaker 2: Housing is the solution to homelessness. I'm not crazy. I don't need to be [unintelligible 00:15:41] I don't need drug treatment, I need affordable housing. This is where we make our stand. We're tired of this trash. Warehouse departments and homeless people, warehouse departments and homeless people. When are we going to see housing?
Brian Lehrer: Mr. Mayor, I hope you were able to hear that well enough down the line but if so, what do you say to that New Yorker who doesn't think you're presenting her with viable housing options if you're going to close the encampment?
Mayor Eric Adams: I'm saying to that New York and other New Yorkers, it's about dignity. When I looked at some of those encampments sites, some of them I visited 1:00, 2:00, 3:00 in the morning, I look inside, talk to people who are homeless, I saw people living in human waste, drug paraphernalia, no showers, no clean clothing, living like that. That is not dignified, that is not acceptable. Other people may ignore it and act like they don't see it, I'm not going to do that.
You have the legal right according to law, to sleep on the street. You don't have the legal right to build encampments on the street. That's not acceptable and I'm not going to continue to ignore that in our city. We're giving people options. I visit our shelters, unannounced, 2:00, 3:00 in the morning, walk in, and I want to see the quality of product that we're producing, and clearly, we have clean, safe sights for New Yorkers who are looking for a place as we transition into permanent housing.
I agree with them, we have to build more affordable housing, we have to give people the services that they need that they can live independently, but to deal with those who are dealing with mental health issues. That's why we have the safe haven beds. This is a right to shelter city. Anyone that wants a bed will have a bed, but we're not going to continue to ignore the undignified way people are sleeping on the streets in these shantytowns and tents and makeshift cardboard boxes. That's not acceptable to me.
Brian Lehrer: This is a state budget question too, I think. With the new budget outline out last night, you've been promoting the safe haven beds with wraparound mental health services, presumably a lot safer, and with a lot more services than the ordinary shelters that people don't seem to want to go to. Did the state budget do anything significant, in your opinion, to scale up Safe Havens and other kinds of actual housing with supportive services?
Mayor Eric Adams: Well, there's a number of things when we deal with as the woman stated, she doesn't have mental health issues, she made a conscious decision that she wanted to live on the street because she wanted housing. We know that that is why we're calling for additional funding so that we can open up the opportunities to build more affordable units. We need help from the state to do so but we also need to deal with the number of people who are dealing with mental health issues that can't take care of themselves.
That's why we need the psychiatric beds reopened. We need a stronger of Kendra's law, that we can identify those who are dealing with real issues but also look at the Ws I got out of this budget in Albany. We were able to get something that I pushed for. Money back into taxpayers' pockets through Earned Income Tax Credits, the childcare dollars that we needed, moving the needle on public state safety. We are still going through the budget. It's really new. We want to look through and see exactly how we apply these resources to the issues that are important to New Yorkers.
Brian Lehrer: Where do you get and not get on bail reform?
Mayor Eric Adams: Again, we're still analyzing. We don't have the full budget to look through right now. We're still analyzing but I'll say this, I commend the lawmakers and governor of who remember when I first went up to push this issue, people said it was impossible. People totally dismissed it but my partner's in Albany that heard me, understood how important it is to close these loopholes of those who are dealing with crime or criminal element in our state. We were able to make some changes but we have more to do. I want to be really clear, there's more to do.
We have to go further but I do want to commend those partners up there that heard me when I visited them and they went back to their respective chambers and stated that we need to give Eric and the other state lawmakers the assistance they need to deal with the violence we're seeing on our streets.
Brian Lehrer: Let me ask you the data question cause as you know, opponents of rolling back bail reform say there's no data that bail reform is linked to any higher crime rates. They say other cities like Philly and Houston that did not have a new bail reform, saw much steeper increases in murder rates than New York. Do you have any data that trumps those comparisons?
Mayor Eric Adams: Yes. Here's what we need to look at. I say this over and over again, and I really need people to visualize this. There are many rivers that feed the sea of violence. You have to dam each river. When you hear people say, "Well, only 500 people that came out that were criminals and came back out and committed a crime." That's 500 shootings. That's 500 potential victims. Those are 500 potential robberies. The reforms I called for was not rolling back our successful reforms. It was tweaking those areas with a small number of people who are repeated offenders are creating havoc and crime in our city.
The police commissioner just rolled out the other day on increasing crime we have in our city and gave cases of people who were arrested for guns coming back out carrying guns again. There's a real energy in the city by bad people and dangerous violent people that there is no repercussions for their violent actions. We have to stop that. This is more than bail reform. Everybody keeps talking about one aspect of my blueprint to end gun violence. That blueprint included a crisis management team, included foster care support, it included discovery. That's the whole plan that we laid out. It's more than just bail. Bail is one of those rivers that we had to dam.
Brian Lehrer: As we run out of time, Mr. Mayor, and as you get toward Yankee Stadium for opening day today, I got to ask you, can our vegan Mayor get Yankee Stadium to have some veggie vendors along with the hotdogs and a beer?
Mayor Eric Adams: [laughs] I'm going to tell them that today. Healthy food is imperative. I believe that health is wealth and we're going to definitely have that conversation. [chuckles]
Brian Lehrer: Veggies dogs, get your veggie dogs. I want to see it, you can help bring it about. Congratulations on 100 days in office. It's just the first inning to torture the baseball metaphor in a four-year term to come. Thank you for coming on. We look forward to many more.
Mayor Eric Adams: Thank you Take care.
Brian Lehrer: Brian Lehrer on WNYC. Back with us now is our mayor Adams reporter, Liz Kim. Hi Liz, were you listening?
Elizabeth Kim: Yes, I was.
Brian Lehrer: Do you make news there in any way?
Elizabeth Kim: I didn't really hear anything new that he hasn't said before. I think that in this week and going into the next week as well, I think he's going to be trying to look at that budget and framing it as a win. He mentioned the Earned Income Tax Credit, which, in fact, is a very significant win. I would remind people that the state and the city have not raised their contribution to that program in nearly 20 years. That is a real policy win for him along with the childcare. I think that as he approaches his 100th day, I think he's going to be looking at all of that. He's going to continue to talk about what he wants to do on crime, on policing, on homeless encampments.
I think he sees those though as winning issues for him.
Brian Lehrer: Listeners, we have a few minutes left in the show, if anybody wants to react to anything you heard from the mayor there, 212-433 WNYC 212-433-9692. The issue of the homeless shelters, he talks about the safe haven beds. He didn't exactly acknowledge but you could tell from the way he was talking that he gets it that people don't want to go to the conventional shelters. He sees it as crucial to break up the encampments even if people want to continue to live as individuals on the street. Who's that really for?
Elizabeth Kim: Well, he frames that very shrewdly because what he never mentions is he never mentions the neighbors or the businesses who don't like the encampments. He doesn't mention what does that do from a tourism standpoint? Instead, he argues about the so-called dignity of those people who are living in those encampments. He talks about them living in their own waste. He's framed this as he's doing it for them. I think that as astute observers of this issue, this has been a longtime issue. It's not just that. There's a lot of politics at play.
I think that this far, he realizes that a lot of these encampments are in Manhattan. I think he's getting pressure from the business community, from communities themselves that don't like to have these encampments in their neighborhoods.
Brian Lehrer: Some reporters on Twitter, in the press corps with you are noting that he said he's heading to Albany, after the game, why would that be on the day after the budget blueprint was released?
Elizabeth Kim: Well, there's a caucus, there's a Puerto Rican caucus this weekend, I was told actually by my colleague, John Campbell. I would expect that that is probably what the mayor is doing this weekend. I think it helps for him to show his face in Albany. There was a little bit of criticism early on that, perhaps the mayor wasn't making as much of an effort as he should and showing his face in the halls of Albany. I think maybe this could also be a little bit of a victory lap for him as well.
Brian Lehrer: He's interesting. His answer was interesting on the data question about bail reform, the reason there's no data as to whether bail reform made a difference is that they didn't really measure it until the bail reform law took effect, correct me if I'm wrong. When he says that there are hundreds of people being released on bail, who then go on to commit crimes, I think statistically, that's true. What we don't know is if there was any other lower rate previously when the previous bail law was in effect, correct?
Elizabeth Kim: Right. I guess just one broader point that not just advocates, but just people who study this stuff have made is that crime has increased in major US cities since the pandemic. It's not just New York. It's happening also in places where there was no bail reform. The argument there is to single out bail reform seems presumptuous.
Brian Lehrer: Fannie in Brooklyn, you're on WNYC. Hi, Fannie.
Fannie: Hi, Brian. Thank you. I love you, I think you're the best, your national institution. You didn't follow up with the mayor on the mask issue, the toddler masking issue. As he's leaning into this, "My scientists are telling me," this is becoming less and less believable because number one, it's against CDC guidance. It doesn't really jive with WHO guidance obviously, which has said since the beginning of the pandemic, "Do not mask if you're under five." Number two, I've seen many, many pictures of the mayor posted by Carnegie Hall on Instagram or other celebrities where he's just there unmasked with tons of adults.
The idea that somehow the toddlers are the only ones that have to remain masked doesn't add up.
Brian Lehrer: His point and I'm going to go for time, but I hear your point, Fannie. His point is that the toddlers are the only ones who cannot be vaccinated. That's the reason for the mass mandate when there's a surge. Liz, does the mayor ever talk about why he is not masked at public events?
Elizabeth Kim: No, and I think that's a fair question because it can sometimes be inconsistent. We have seen some press appearances in which he's with his health officials and he is masked. I think maybe you can make an argument that it's also the size of the venue. Obviously, if he's outdoors, it's not as dangerous to not wear a mask. To the caller's point, yes, the mayor has always pointed out that it's because this is a group that is considered more vulnerable because they cannot get vaccinated. I would say that like he says, he's following the guidance because you can clearly tell that the mayor does really want to remove masks.
He did it for kids five and up, and even that was controversial because some people thought that they should still be wearing masks.
Brian Lehrer: Ethan and Brooklyn. You're on WNYC. Hi Ethan.
Ethan: Hey Brian, how are you doing? I'm so glad that the mayor is appearing on the show. I was about to email him today to say he has to start doing that because it was so great with de Blasio. Anyway, I just wanted to say this. I don't want to hear any more cheerleading for New Yorkers or sickle fancy or platitudes from him. So many of your questions he answered with New Yorkers have great ideas and there's a lot of energy. Enough. It's like those subway ads with the company arriving in New York where they want to, I don't know if a guy can say kiss the ass of New York on the air, but he needs to just get very with his answers. Enough with the cheerleading. That's my comment.
Brian Lehrer: Ethan, thank you very much. Public officials do need to cheerlead for themselves to some degree. I know any number of elected officials, Liz who have not been reelected when they've tried to, and they say, "I didn't commute very well with the people what I was actually doing." I don't know, where do we put mayor Adams on that scale?
Elizabeth Kim: I think it's a sharp shift from his predecessor Bill de Blasio, who is often criticized for not being a great communicator, but maybe not having also great chemistry with New York workers. Having watched mayor Adams on the city streets, he goes out of his way to say hello to often startled-looking New Yorkers who don't expect to run into the mayor. He really likes that human interaction with everyday New Yorkers. I think there's something to be said for that. It's something we haven't seen many people say since Mayor Koch.
I think prior to last year during the campaign, a lot of people were talking about Andrew Yang and how great he was going to be because he's so energetic and he's such a natural cheerleader. Now we have that in mayor Adams
Brian Lehrer: Liz Kim covers mayor Adams for WNYC and Gothamist. Thanks a lot, Liz.
Elizabeth Kim: Thanks, Brian.
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