Stories of Modern Love

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Brian Lehrer: Brian Lehrer on WNYC. The New York Times column Modern Love has become incredibly popular in the last few years. Let me read you a few headlines and you'll definitely understand why, what I learned from my Instagram crush, spending my tenderness on animals and one of our favorite’s monogamous birds of New York City.

Maybe these stories have been small comforts for you in these hard times, or maybe you're trying to work through the logistics of love in the pandemic and need a little inspiration. I'm joined now by Miya Lee and Daniel Jones, co-hosts of the Modern Love podcast, which is back for a new season. Miya is editor of Modern Love projects, as well as co-host of the Modern Love podcast. Miya and Dan, welcome to WNYC. Hi there.

Daniel Jones: Hey, good to be here.

Miya Lee: Hi, thanks for having us.

Brian: You're doing a lot about dating during the coronavirus pandemic.

Daniel: Yes, we have-- It was such a sea change when the pandemic struck in New York, anyway in mid-March, and I remember we were sent away from The Times office with- I think it was word, Mia can correct me if I'm wrong, that we'd be away for two weeks, and we thought, "Oh my God, how are we going to put out the paper for two weeks, all of us out of the office?"

It's been 30 weeks. What happened immediately, I think, in the dating world is that there was no such thing as casual anymore. It created this sea change of people who needed to isolate and quarantine for unknown amounts of time. I think back then it was at least six weeks or so that people were cooped up. What really struck us both, I think, early on were these stories of people deciding either to fish or cut bait, they needed to either jump all into a relationship that may have been casual, or jump out and endure this alone, and that was so interesting to observe.

Brian: Listeners, we're going to invite you to participate in this because, I think, Miya and Dan would love to hear these stories. Maybe you'll wind up in a future Modern Love column or podcast. Call in and they need to be short, but call in with your tiny love stories. They have that form that they call it Tiny Love Stories of meeting somebody, and it could be a new lover or could even be a new friend since the middle of March. How are you able to be responsible and still form a new relationship? What's your tiny love story? 646-435-7280.

Lets get a couple in here that Miya and Dan might enjoy hearing even as we enjoy hearing from them. This is our on air number. This is not the same as the pledge drive number that I was giving you before. We will never ask you for money on the air. That is for sure. With your tiny love story of making a new friend or a new lover

during coronavirus, 646-435-7280, 646-435-7280. Miya, I see you've been reading Modern Love submissions ever since you were a freshman in college. Are there stories that you found most influential and pushed you toward becoming part of this yourself?

Miya: I have one, actually, favorite story. My favorite kind of change, week-to-week, month-to-month, but one that has really stayed with me is When It's Being Together Worth 550 an Hour written by a woman who was dating someone, and she had to pay for parking outside of his apartment. She had to ask herself, is this hour spent with him worth 550? It became a larger meditation on value in relationships, investment in relationships, and a larger lesson of how you have to invest equally in relationships, whether it's time or emotional energy.

Brian: Do you have a favorite Modern Love essay of all time, Dan?

Daniel: My default for that is the one that took off like no other, which was called To Fall in Love with Anyone Do This and was read by tens of millions of people and focused on a couple who were strangers who decided to do a psychological experiment. They were supposed to foster intimacy and they were to ask each other the same set of 36 questions.

That's supposedly took you deeper and deeper into each other's loves and hates and childhoods and fears and hopes. That one was just so fun because it had such impact and led to countless marriages and relationships. It popularized these questions that had in fact been around, I think, since the late '90s, but that's surfaced them in a big way, and it changed a lot of people's worlds, honestly.

Brian: In the most recent episode of the podcast, you asked Miya what surprised her most going through this year's Modern Love submissions. I will pose that question since you've been Modern Love editor ever since the column debuted, I think 16 years ago, what surprised you this year going through submissions?

Daniel: Are you asking me or Miya?

Brian: Yes, you.

Daniel: Oh, Modern Love doesn't necessarily follow the news. In fact, it's often thought of as counter-programming to the news, and we're not expected to have essays that reflect what's happening week-to-week. We, at the beginning, didn't think the pandemic would honestly be any different. We thought we'd still be running stories that were about all kinds of things, but the submissions became-- I don't know, we were just talking about this earlier. I think 80% pandemic influenced stories.

It just became something that had invaded everyone's lives. It had changed everyone's relationships. On top of that, a lot of people were home. A lot of people were unemployed, and they were wanting to write about it and figure it out. This year has been- and like a lot of other corners of society, this year has been dominated by the pandemic and people trying to figure out how this has changed, love and connection.

Brian: Miya, same question.

Miya: Yes. I guess I was surprised by how well some people are coping actually in this time. I know that this is a time of immense isolation and stress, but a lot of people are finding creative ways to connect or just to survive the people that they're living with. There was one couple that started to argue in British accents, American couple, just to keep things light and not to take things too seriously, so yes, surprised by the light, actually that's possible now.

Daniel: Picking up on that, another we do, we did a project where we asked people who are isolated completely by themselves in their apartments, how they were fairing, and several of those people, and one in particular was celebrating not having to have fear of missing out, not having anything, knowing that no one was doing anything, and she liked being alone anyway. It felt like, it was a relief, and that was more broad spread than just one person. I think some people really took solace in the fact that they weren't missing out on anything. Everybody was home.

Brian: Let's hear a few of our listeners pandemic tiny loves stories, Justine in Brooklyn. You're on WNYC. Hi, Justine.

Justine: Hi, Brian. Thank you so much for having me. I love your show. Thank you so much for all the work that you do, really admire you.

Brian: Thank you so much.

Justine: Yes. My tiny love story. It is tiny, but it spans miles. I also live alone and had been alone since March and "met" someone on Instagram. He commented on one of my stories. I had been Insta-suggested to him as a friend, we have a lot of mutual friends, and so he commented on one of my stories and we got to talking. He lives in Brooklyn, but he had been quarantining with his parents in New Orleans, and then he bought a car and then drove back up from New Orleans to Brooklyn, and we have been dating ever since June.

Daniel: Wow. Good for you.

Brian: It is a beautiful story, Justine. Thank you very much. We're going to go to Leah in Brooklyn. You're on WNYC. Hi, Leah.

Leah: Hi. It's so exciting to be here. Yes. My quarantine story. I had been seeing someone casual before corona hit. We kind of faded out, but kept in touch a little bit, and then about two weeks before quarantine, I started seeing someone very casually, but we quickly decided to quarantine together. During that time, like being thrown together so quickly, like birds who are inrelationship, and it really revealed like how incompatible we were very quickly.

During that time, I kept in touch with the previous person, and because we weren't quarantining together and we were apart, our emotional bond really grew. Once we felt comfortable, social distancing and seeing each other again, we decided to see each other and got together a lot more seriously.

Brian: Those are two really good stories. Leah. Miya, I'll bet you hear a lot of those. Would a lot be overstating it? People who decided to quarantine together who were in relationships that were too new, and maybe like Leah, it didn't work out, or maybe it did.

Miya: Yes. It seems to kind of accelerate relationships. You can see if they're doomed or if they actually work well. I know some people-- There was one story in our alone project. I have a couple that just knew, "Oh, we have to break up and go our separate ways."

Brian: One more. David in Harlem. You're on WNYC. Hi, David.

David: Hi, [unintelligible 00:12:19] caller, love your story. Thank you so much. You keep us company every day. I just wanted to say is, I don't know, maybe a promiscuous homosexual that pandemic has been interesting for people like me. I feel like maybe our community has a little bit of a jump-start in having to negotiate how to open up our bubble. We've had the testing for HIVs for years of like, just get tested and know your status. I feel like that has created new social norms. It's like, cool, I'll be tested and I'll be distant for two weeks, and then I can safely play as it were.

I feel like that's kind of how, at least my social group, or like what we've been talking about, how we've been opening up safely, being ethical flood as it were.

Brian: David, thank you very much. Dan, in our last minute, you want to comment on that? I guess that becomes part of the new negotiation over when relationships proceed to the physical. Do you require the other person to get tested or all that kind of thing, and tell us what you've got coming up on the podcast. Dan, you want to take that?

Daniel: Yes, there've been two interesting development, it's during this time and-- I have a poor connection. I'm not sure if it's coming through clearly.

Brian: We got you.

Daniel: Can you hear me?

Brian: Yes. We do.

Daniel: Okay. The negotiation over how do we get together in person and what are the risks we're willing to take, it's interesting that he was talking about HIV and being tested and a familiarity with all that. It becomes in the pandemic like, who is your safe circle, and then how far outside of that are you willing to go, and who else are you going to put at risk? Then the flip side of that are a lot of deep emotional relationships that never crossed to the physical, people who are online dating.

I think one of the services, Tinder, I believe just opened its borders and said, "You can be in touch with anyone in the world, basically." Again, that sense of relief that you don't have to actually meet in person and you can get to know each other really deeply through messaging and storytelling and getting certain matters of the heart.

I'm curious where those end up once this all ends.

Brian: Yes. Thank you so much for your storytelling. I know it's wildly popular, so it's been great to have Miya Lee and Daniel Jones, co-hosts of the podcast Modern Love from The New York Times. The first two episodes of the new Modern Love season are up and available to stream online. Thank you both so much.

Daniel: Thank you, Brian.

Miya: Thank you.

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